Greg Bailey has now been involved in an almost dizzying number of startups. Now with his latest venture, he is aiming to help you live healthier, and for longer. The startup, Juvenescence, attracted funding from top-tier investors like Longevity Vision Fund, Foresite Capital, Fastforward Innovations, and Grok Ventures.
In this episode, you will learn:
- What Juvenescence is working on
- Tips for living longer and healthier
- The advantages of ketosis
- His top advice when considering launching a business
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About Greg Bailey:
Dr. Greg Bailey, MD, a co-founder and the CEO of Juvenescence, is a physician, financier, and biotech entrepreneur with extensive experience founding and financing healthcare companies.
Dr. Bailey is driven by the important opportunity to truly modify aging based on rigorous science. The goal: to use his track record and drug development expertise, and that of his partners, to find compelling products and raise the extraordinary amount of money necessary to fulfill the promise of Juvenescence.
Dr. Bailey is also the chairman of Portage Biotech, Inc. (PTGEF: OTCBB), a publicly-traded oncology drug development company. He was a former managing partner of Palantir Group, Inc., a merchant bank specializing in biotech and intellectual property, and he was the initial financier and an independent director of Medivation, Inc. (MDVN: NASDAQ), acquired by Pfizer in 2016. He also led the seed financing of Biohaven Pharmaceuticals Holding Company Ltd. and joined the board in 2014.
Previously he founded or financed Ascent Healthcare Solutions, VirnetX Inc. (VHC: AMEX), and SalvaRx Group PLC. Dr. Bailey has an MD from the University of Western Ontario and practiced emergency medicine for 10 years prior to becoming a serial entrepreneur.
Greg has embraced a healthy lifestyle that includes biohacking, a proper diet, and a comprehensive exercise program: high-intensity training, weightlifting, aerobic exercise, and yoga
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Connect with Greg Bailey:
Read the Full Transcription of the Interview:
Alejandro Cremades: All alrighty hello everyone and welcome to the deal maker show. So today. We have a very exciting founder with us. You know we’re gonna be learning a lot about building and scaling I mean I got to tell you I almost lost struck with all the companies that this founder you know has been part of but I think that his journey is remarkable and we’re gonna find it. very very inspiring so I guess without further ado. Let’s welcome our guest today Greg Bailey welcome to the show.
Greg Bailey: Thank you Alehandra A pleasure to be here.
Alejandro Cremades: So born in Toronto canada you know, give us a little of a walk through Memory Lane Greg how was life growing up there.
Greg Bailey: Um, it was good it you know cold in the you know Canada has 2 seasons July and winter. But it was so good and you know have very good education system. You know a kind of a comfortable place to grow up.
Alejandro Cremades: So At what point you know, do you decide that perhaps the um, the Healthcare or medicine is going to be you know for you because that’s what you know the career or perhaps like the path that you chose to go with you know in terms of Study. So. Ah, what point he became evident that was you know the right path for you.
Greg Bailey: 2 aspects to that andra one was my mother had always wanted to be a doctor but she was a child protegey in music so she went down. She ended up being pushed down that pathway and the second one was when I was six years old the little girl who lived 2 doors down from me. Ah, developed meningitiss and they took her to the hospital and she died and as a 6 year- old I couldn’t fathom how her going to the hospital had ended up with her dying and my mother tried to explain she unfortunately was allergic to the antibiotics would have saved her life but it was unfathomable to a 6 year -old so it. Probably left an indelible mark Mark certainly has dictated my latest company.
Alejandro Cremades: And we’ll talk about your latest company just a little bit I guess say for you right? after you know, studying you know medicine you know and you went to medical medical school.
Greg Bailey: Again.
Alejandro Cremades: Um, you decided to go into emergency medicine. What does it mean emergency medicine and what were you doing during this time.
Greg Bailey: Um, basically you know any accident sudden um pathologies that prefall somebody you come into the emergency department at the hospital and so you’re the first person the first doctor that sees them. If they’re not specifically for an existing physician so car accidents heart attacks. Um all sorts of you know the miscellaneous things we do to ourselves so I did that for 10 years
Alejandro Cremades: And at what point do you realize that they maybe there is something else. You know for you.
Greg Bailey: Ah, the problem with being an emergency room doctor is 20 to 30% of everyone you see after Eight o’clock is drunk. They hurt themselves and they’re obnoxious so it was I was losing my empathy so it was time to move on and happily I’d been successfully creating a career. In business along with practicing medicine.
Alejandro Cremades: So then in in this regard I mean you also got your feet wet when it came to syndicating real state. Ah you know stuff I mean medical medical buildings. So how did this initiative come about and and what was this exactly.
Greg Bailey: So when I was practicing medicine and a large number of friends who were in the real estate market. It was very hot real estate market back in the 80 s in Canada and so I got brought in and we saw buildings that we thought we could turn into medical buildings. And so we syndicated those opportunities back to physicians um and basically created a portfolio that we subsequently sold.
Alejandro Cremades: That’s amazing now you know, obviously you know there’s a ton of companies that you’ve done you know and I want to make sure that you know for the listeners you know were able to give enough time to what you’re up to you know with juvenience. Which he’s saying pretty interesting stuff you know and there’s some really interesting questions there that I like to ask you too on how to live better supplements and and things like that I guess you know why don’t we do this. Why don’t we go company by company and you tell me what was the biggest lesson learned and also what ended up being. The outcome of that experience and perhaps you know you give us like ah 30 seconds on on what you guys were doing with that company that you found it. So first one ascent healthcare you know back in 9096 where you got started there and you were also not only on the founding team but then also a board member.
Greg Bailey: Um.
Alejandro Cremades: What were you guys there doing there and what was the lesson learned and also the outcome.
Greg Bailey: Yeah, there was a fabulous situation and basically we would buy the equipment that hospitals were throwing out and like laparoscopic scissors and andosry and we’d clean it up and we’d sell it back to them so you would. Basically buy it for pennies and sell it back for dollars. It was just a fantastic business model. No barrier to entry which is very very important was a valuable lesson learn. It was my first Vc deal. Um, basically they came in and they changed the price last minute when they knew they had a gun doer head from $2 a share. ¢50 so it was my first and last vc deal. So no, basically it’s sold for five hundred and twenty one million the five hundred and twenty was for the vcs. The 1000000 was for me. So don’t do vc deals was the takeaway on that one.
Alejandro Cremades: And and in that case, you know Obviously you also on this one had full visibility into the full cycle of a company right? like racing and exit and all that stuff what kind of what kind of clarity did you get from.
Greg Bailey: Monument.
Greg Bailey: Um, they live.
Alejandro Cremades: From that from achieving the finish line of of the cycle of a business from from inception to to to really exit I mean what kind of what kind of access or or education would you say that gave you to know that you could do that again.
Greg Bailey: Um, basically you learn it takes 4 times more money than you thought it would do and it takes 4 times longer Those are my rule of four that I learned from that business. It just takes so much time it always happens much slower than you anticipate deals have their own chronology and despite whatever you want you. Can’t accelerate them. They’re going to evolve as they evolve so that was my biggest takeaway from that The other aspect was that I felt that I was comfortable finding opportunities that were financiable. You know and that I was able to. Dictate the level of conversation so that a person who wasn’t medical could understand what I was saying to get investors.
Alejandro Cremades: And the next one the next rodeo ah vernet x you know that you did you know in 2005 there you were a founder and and. And there was quite a few lawsuits there that that that were happening too. So why? So what happened you know with those lawsuits and and then also you know what? what were you guys doing and what was the outcome.
Greg Bailey: There was another one just before called meditation which we started in 2004 but I wasn’t a founder but moving circle back to that one if you want because I learned an awful lot from that one. Um where we created the number 1 drug in the world for prostate cancer. So basically vernetics.
Alejandro Cremades: Yeah.
Greg Bailey: Was interesting. You know that you would be able to tie up a technology that was very exciting but you know getting people to license it particularly if they had an existing project. You know, ah particularly in the United States was fraught with legal complications. So we notified you know Microsoft at the time that they needed to license our product. They told us to go away and we eventually had to unfortunately sue them and happily we won and $200000000 and then we had next up was apple who was using it for facetime. Should have had a license from us and we are now 18 years later and they still have not settled with us. They continue to fight with us because one of the courts awarded us a half percent of the sale of every ipad and iphone sold in the world and that works up to $300000 a day. So.
Greg Bailey: Apple is going to fight this and my grandchildren probably won’t see this money and um I don’t have children yet.
Alejandro Cremades: Wow, That’s incredible like how typically those those those legal proceedings you know take so long. Unbelievable Now. Let’s go back to to Motivation motivation there. You were the. Financier and then also um, an independent director. Um, you know, definitely prostate. The country is a really really big Problem. So How was that journey there with motivation.
Greg Bailey: Yes, it was what taught me if you’re going to do biotech you want to do 10 projects and try to be right on 1 and if you do that you’ll deliver an extraordinary return for the investors. So we started out with 1 product in alzheimer’s disease and we added the second product for prostate cancer. We had the best results the worlds at the time had ever seen an alzheimer’s disease and phase 2 and then failed in phase 3 but happily had the prostate cancer coming along. We had the best. Results or we had comparable results to a competitor in our prostate cancer drug as well and it was because we had two. We had this portfolio that we were able to survive the other thing that I learned is you know to work very very closely with the Fda and the regulatory bodies if you pre-empt that so they know what you’re doing in advance. It’s a much smoother journey and so happily it worked out well. Prostate cancer was incredibly successful. Did four point five billion in sales last year and unfortunately it is such a big problem for men over 250000 men will be diagnosed with prostate cancer this year
Alejandro Cremades: Wow and when it comes to um to investing in in biotech and and projects like this I mean what? what? what are your thoughts there on the ingredients. You know the 3 main ingredients that get you excited about you know? ah.
Greg Bailey: India in Europe.
Alejandro Cremades: Deploying Capital in a biotech company and and why.
Greg Bailey: Yeah I’ve been really fortunate you know and in a despite even the statement I’m about to make will clarify the number one point I’ve worked with extraordinary people so that my biotech companies have gone through $25000000000 in market cap and so one is work with extraordinary people. Second male element is to have a portfolio at bothion and subsequently in biohave and now juveesence you know we have multiple products and you know on this thesis that if you do 10 you can be right on 1 what’s really important and most people go I don’t understand biotech I can’t invest but it’s very similar to mining. You know you put the money in you, you run your clinical trial and if it’s successful. You’re worth 10 times what you were worth the day before and if it’s unsuccessful. You’re worth half of what you were worth before. So it’s an odds game your chance of having a successful clinical trial that will have that 10 x increase in valuation. Is usually at phase 2 your chance with successful phase 2 varies historically between 22 and 54 and I appreciate. That’s a huge delta so it’s 22% for cancer and autoimmune because placebo does really? Well so it’s hard to differentiate. And it’s fifty. Four percent for antibiotics for insulin because we worked in phase one. It’s going to work in phase 2 but if helejaro if you and I can be right one out of every 3 times and you made 10 times your money. How long would you play at a table in Monaco if every third hand you won 10 times your money but you can’t make just one bet. So.
Greg Bailey: Goal is to have this portfolio approach work with extraordinary people and have uncorrelated assets so that you don’t sink or swim with all ten and I think that you can do incredibly well in biotech.
Alejandro Cremades: I Love that Now. Let’s talk about portage. You know we change which you were there involved as a found cofounder and then also Chairman that you know ended up. Ah you know, having assets worth 900000000 And obviously there’s all types of dividends that were paid out to investors and all of that stuff. But but I guess you know the question here is what were you guys doing there now. What really ended up being the outcome on the lesson for you.
Greg Bailey: So you know as you’ve gathered from my conversation dig multiple products so we we took over the company and reconstituted it in 2013 and basically went to make 10 bets worked with extraordinary people had a gentleman named Jim Mallon who’s of polymath. And ah Declin Dugan who is the Ceo who’s the former head of drug development Pfizer. So we went out to get the 10 projects and as one of my allies. Alex Pickett said 1 of our children ate the other ones it became so obvious which asset we’d invested in was key. So we ended up investing $7000000 in ah in a company that Declan started and I became a board of director and used the money from portage to finance called biohaver and as you say we invested $7000000 we dividended it four years later to our shareholders which basically was worth about two hundred and twenty million dollars had they held those shares today. They’re worth over 900000000? Um, and so again, we bet with bio behavior we were betting on great people. They had a multiple portfolio entity and. And even at portage we did that and subsequently after doing the dividend we acquired assets from another company that we started called salvvaex in immuno oncology and there we’re building the portfolio currently, we have 3 different products at portage.
Alejandro Cremades: And then you know the the last one that I want to ask you before really getting into you incence is Chelsea I there I know that chelsea avin daily is a still ongoing. You know it has a raise some cash. So what’s the deal with with this one? yeah.
Greg Bailey: Yeah, so this was definitely straying outside of you know my sweet spot as I said you know the lesson I learned from biotech and from the predecessor company ascent healthcare was not to deal with vcs and to deal with extraordinary people. Ah, came ah again, ah across a savant in the and in the industry nylash viani in in in insurance and I thought that this is an extraordinary person so I threw a great deal of capital behind him $25000000 and we started to build this insurance company and reinsurance company and nalesh has just done an extraordinary job building the company. Um, where we have just beat the industry odds dramatically by creating our own software to assess risk in property and casualty. And subsequently we’ve raised you know, further $50000000 from third party investors in a small round of before that of of $20000000 so it’s actually more that we raise.
Alejandro Cremades: So then let’s talk about now about the juanescence you know your ah your latest baby and here you are the the Ceo as well and one of the co-founders. Ah, what point do you become interested into aging and you know lifestyle and you know and all of that stuff I mean at what point that’s the idea come knocking to you.
Greg Bailey: Um I looked at getting into the vitamin supplement industry in the in the 90 s and couldn’t find a place where I could differentiate. It. So I’ve always been sort of inclined and then being a physician just paying attention. You know to articles that are coming out. Began to you know, go on my own personal journey to try and you know stay healthy stay fit eat properly in twelve ten years ago now I met a guy named Luigi Fotana Luigi is the number 1 person in the world on caloric restriction. 1800 calorish men twelve hundred calories women and you will live longer and you’ll stay healthy the next year I met Volter Longo and volter and his research at Usc had found out that you could almost get the same result without having to do it every day if once every three months you did five days eight hundred calories and if you do that you mimic a very similar response by your bodies if you’ve been starving yourself for the full three months so that that was interesting the next person I met was Walter Bortz who is then head of gerontology at Stanford and he said if you’re fit you mentally and physically decline at half percent a year unfit 2% a year well that’s a heck of a delta you know to do that and I guess my epiphany at that moment was there’s nothing magical about exercise or diet. You know. Basically they must be doing something on a cellular level and.
Greg Bailey: So then I started to dig in and found out the scientists were discovering the four major pathways that cause your cells to age and so one thing I know about scientists if they know the pathways they’re going to figure out how to tinker with it. So I started bombarding my two partners Declan and Jim from portage and Biohaven. With articles showing how the scientists were sorting this out and you know and Jim five years ago six years ago picked up the ball and said I’m going to write a book about this I’m going ah meet the top people in the world I’m going to go to the number 1 institutions in the world and you know. And put together this book and he basically gave Declan and I a roadmap of all the people we should be speaking to to build a company to truly modify how you age so we have 11 products right now that hopefully. We’ll pan out in clinical trials where we will be able to slow halt or reverse aging.
Alejandro Cremades: So alter and reverse aging I mean that sounds like I mean if if you were to actually achieve that What would it look like.
Greg Bailey: You know I mean it. It has enormous and profound consequences to humanity. Um, the 1 thing I’ll say a handroid’s going to happen so much faster than your viewers think these products are going to come to market very quickly. You know we launched a ketone esther. We know that you know the University Of California Berkeley found that animals that were in ketosis on a chronic basis lived 25% longer protects their heart and their brain. So here’s a product you can get today that could potentially materially change how long you live. Have another product we license in from university of Michigan and the people who have this pathway turned on live long 8 to 10 years longer healthy in January six we published our scientists published that they cut off the limb of a living entity and regrew a functional limb. It was in a frog. And they’ve now reproducing the model in a mouse so science fiction is becoming science recently David Sinclair’s lab out of harvard said that they were able to epigeneically which is basically change your genes and your Dna while you’re alive. We’re able to reverse aging in mice. So as I said happens so much faster than you think this has just been an amazing journey for me to see what’s coming and to work with some of the smartest people in the world addressing 1 of the biggest issues in the world.
Alejandro Cremades: And no kidding.
Greg Bailey: You know Longevity healthy longevity.
Alejandro Cremades: And in terms of um Capital I mean you see this is capital intensive to be able to achieve all this stuff How much money have you guys raised today.
Greg Bailey: Um, juven essence is raised 249,000,000 today
Alejandro Cremades: And how how did you go about racing this because obviously you had the lessons learned from raising venture money on the first rodeo. So how did you go about raising money now for this one.
Greg Bailey: I know this is going to come to it as a shock to you and to your viewing audience but wealthy people want to live longer who knew so our first financings were a lot of ultra highh ne worths who were betting on us to find the drugs that would allow them to live longer healthy. Have a couple of biotech funds. We have an insurance company as well and the founders have put in $75000000 so we’re in the midst of a raise now one hundred and fifty million dollar raise with barclays and our goal now is to bring in more of the institutional investors. To prepare for a public offering in the next twelve to twenty four months market willing I think.
Alejandro Cremades: That’s incredible that’s incredible now you were talking about those products those 11 products that you’re working on I mean typically what is the process of getting one of those products to market.
Greg Bailey: There’s 2 paths you can take surprisingly and it was interesting because I always used to get in trouble with people saying why don’t you do more natural products and not realizing that some of the biggest blockbusters in medicine are actually natural products. Aspirin is a natural product. Digitalis is a natural product. But so we found a lot of natural products that that actually materially change how long you age and so with those because they’re safe. You can go a pathway with the regulatory body called generally recognized as safe and you can get them on the market in under 2 years. So we have indeed done that with some of our natural products. That’s how we got the ketone ester onto the market you know in just under 2 years then there’s others that are more conventional. You know there’s regular pharmaceuticals like the one out of university of Michigan where you literally need to do the 7 to 8 ight years clinical trials phase one and phase 2 phase 3 and can cost up to $100000000 to bring them to clinic and then the regeneration. The regulatory bodies are you know, regrowing the limb are still sorting out the pathway for something like that. So you have to be particularly creative. And how you work around the regulatory body if you and I had a product today that allowed people to live 10 years longer healthy. There is no regulatory pathway to get it on the market. They haven’t recognized aging as a disease the world health organization did in 2018 so it’s coming.
Greg Bailey: And it’s going. You know the regulatory bodies will catch up but it’s still a work in progress happily all the drugs that I live longer generally treat the chronic disease of aging as well.
Alejandro Cremades: So obviously Greg you know it sounds like you know it’s gonna take some time for me to be able to go to like you know my my nearby you know pharmacy you know or store and and and buy the product. You know to help me live longer I guess you know if you were in my shoes now and I’m like hey i. I want to live longer. What should I do right.
Greg Bailey: So um, couple of things you know the number 1 lifestyle thing you can do I agree with Walter Bortz and Stanford is fitness. You materially change by 4 x your mental and your physical. Generation as you age as you you know if you look at 60 year old seventy year olds who are fit versus the ones that aren’t I mean it’s night and day they look like they’re from different planets. So that’s number 1 number 2 lifestyle thing is obviously diet. You know. We now know out of a study that came out in January Two Thousand and eighteen there is no perfect diet. It’s ethnocentric white japanese people can eat white rice without getting diabetes of you and I at the same amount. There’s a very good chance we become diabetic. The Mediterranean diet for most you know Caucasian people from Europe is. Is probably the best diet 10 to 12 servings of vegetables 3 to 5 servings of fruit Scott Simpson at the Perkinson Institute says you massively over eat protein that protein should only be 15 to 20% of your diet healthy carbs should be 70% in the relf should be healthy fats so diet would come next. As far as drugs and supplements I do think being in ketosis regularly and you can get products that put you into ketosis today will materially change how you live and then as I’ve said there’s going to be 3 or 4 more natural products that come down that will directly affect.
Alejandro Cremades: And really quickly for the people that are listening that are like what is Ketosis What what is ketosis for the people that are listening.
Greg Bailey: Your aging process.
Greg Bailey: Yeah, so basically if you stop eating Today. You probably have about 36 hours of blood sugar in in your body and you have to eat through it first use it up as cells after that you’ll begin to break down fat. And when you break down fats they become ketones and when they break and the liver turns them into something called bhb that your cell can then use as energy what we’ve learned the last few years is bhbketones are a much better food source for a lot of your cells than using sugar. You know sugar is obviously to become glucose a bad actor. So the more times I can be using ketones and phb the more advantageous it is to my health. What we’ve learned in the last ten years is I don’t have to starve myself to get into ketosis we’re a drug development company. So we discovered this ketone they reader discovered when we inlicen this one from the buck institute what we did was we found out you take a drink of ketones our ketone ester within 15 to 30 minutes you will be in ketosis your ketones will have it. Nice robust level in your blood system. So your cells can use it as an energy source I don’t have to starve myself to get there I can do it simply by taking this drink so this has been a big deal and it’s you know, basically the the science is all sorts of.
Greg Bailey: Different universities have validated the key you want to be in Ketosis on ah on a regular basis and it’s much easier to do by drinking something than starving yourself or a Keto ketogenic diet which is also difficult.
Alejandro Cremades: That’s incredible and and just you know out of curiosity you know for the supplements you know any a specific supplement that you think you know like should be a must.
Greg Bailey: Yeah I think that there was a study that came out this summer that said, if you’re on fish oil Omega 3 and vitamin d 3 and you’re fit you decrease your chance of cancer by sixty six zero that’s a huge percentage.
Alejandro Cremades: Wow.
Greg Bailey: Study needs to be repeated I don’t think it was a perfect study but vitamin d 3 and omega 3 are you know, incredibly safe and fitness is just generally good. So there’s no sort of downside to following that regimen right? Why not.
Alejandro Cremades: Yeah, ops a hundred percent
Greg Bailey: We do know that vitamin d 3 has all sorts of wonderful benefits same with omega three effect on inflammation I would also Mayo Clinic has begun to promote folate vitamin b six as a very important one that potentially is anti-aging. Lots of people talk about tumeric kirkoman the you know the herb that everybody in India uses in ah plentifully um so those are you know? Nice safe, easy ones to take and then you can get into more esoteric things. There’s a. Drug you can buy over the counter in Spain italy and portugal called metformin and people who are on metformin seem to have a lower incidence of cancer and alzheimer’s disease einstein university is in the midst of running a clinical putting together a clinical trial to see whether metformin is legitimately an anti-aging drop and. I’ve been taking afraid to 9 years now metformin um so there’s big gun.
Alejandro Cremades: Wow, that’s amazing now now Greg question here. Imagine you go to sleep tonight and you wake up in a world and this is gonna this is gonna look beautiful to you this world in a world where the vision of juven essence is fully realized. What does that world look like.
Greg Bailey: So our goal we started. The company was not to increase how long you live was how to to increase how long you live healthy. We have a huge crisis about to face the world Alejandro we do not have enough money to afford to take care of the elderly. We have an inverted pyramid. Not enough young people of the base to support financially the older people and we’re living longer but unhealthy so we have to get them to live longer healthy. So my world of juvenessence is right in the near term to be able to do this gives you an 85 year old who’s still. Participating in life. You know has a sense of purpose is healthy because we know that 95% of the budget of socialized medicine has spent on the last five years of life it wouldn’t it be great difference between when you are healthy and when you die now is 10 years difference between health span and lifespan. Would be great if it was one week one day 1 hour you were healthy up until the end interestingly and I don’t know why and everybody asked Denmark is 3 years between when they’re healthy and when they die so that was always our aspiration mind you if we do this, you’ll clearly live longer. But that was ah so my world of June in essence if we were to realize this dream is to do this It’s also not only the slow cellular aging but I also need to prevent the degeneration of tissues because of you went out in the sun or you hurt your knee skiing or playing tennis. So can I regenerate a knee.
Greg Bailey: And so that’s why we’re also doing the regeneration where we regrew the length.
Alejandro Cremades: Wow now. Obviously here we’re talking about the future. But imagine if you were able. You know if I was let’s talk about the past here imagine I was to put you into a time machine and I bring you back in time and I bring you back to that time you know, perhaps in the 90 s. Where you were you know, thinking now about leaving emergency medicine and and going more and and tackling the business side of things and you had the opportunity of having a sit down with that younger Greg and being able to give that younger Greg. 1 piece of advice before launching a business. What would that be and why given what you know now.
Greg Bailey: Um, um, good question tricky question through 1 piece of advice I give you I guess work with extraordinary people. You know. There’s been lots of quotes you want to be the dumbest person in the room and you’re in the right room you know because then you have the greatest opportunity for success and so it took me a little bit to sort it through but that unequivocally there’s lots of great products that have never seen the light of day because it didn’t have good managers. And there’s lots of companies that had very average products but they had great management and the managers landed on their feet and made extraordinary businesses so that would probably what I would tell myself.
Alejandro Cremades: That’s amazing, very profound now Greg for the people that are listening. You know that and that will love to get in chat in touch and say hi. What is the best way for them to do so okay.
Greg Bailey: Yeah, internet email is probably the best. It’s ah Greg g r e g at juov labs and joov labs is j u v l a b s dot com so Greg at juvelabs.com
Alejandro Cremades: Amazing, amazing! Well Greg thank you so so much for being on the deal maker show. It has been an honor to have you with us.
Greg Bailey: A complete pleasure Ale Handra thank you very much for having me.
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