Neil Patel

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Erik Martinson’s solar startup has now raised well over $200M. With big plans to continue to scale beyond their current footholds in Europe. The venture, Svea Solar, has attracted funding from top-tier investors like Altor, D-Ax Corporate Venture Capital, and angel investors.

In this episode, you will learn:

  • This entrepreneur’s top advice when starting a company
  • How to get in touch with Erik Martinson
  • The future of cleantech in the world

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    About Erik Martinson:

    Erik Martinson is the CEO, Co-founder of Svea Solar, and a member of the board of directors. He founded Svea Solar together with Björn Lind (COO) in 2014. Svea Solar has, within 8 years, become one of the leading solar energy companies in Europe and is Sweden’s fastest-growing cleantech company.

    As CEO, Erik is responsible for guiding the vision to liberate the world from harmful energy, by making solar energy accessible for all. Prior to founding Svea Solar, he received a master’s degree in Industrial Engineering and Science from Linköping University.

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    Connect with Erik Martinson:

    Read the Full Transcription of the Interview:

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, alright hello everyone and welcome to the dealmakerr show. So I’m very excited with the guest that we have today. We’re going to be talking a lot about building financing and then also like doing this as well in Europe. So um, again, you know we’re going to find this story very inspiring. And I don’t want to wait I don’t want to make anyone wait any longer so without farther ado let’s welcome our guest today Eric Martinson welcome to the show. So originally born outside of Stockholm Eric so give us enough I walk through memory lane. How was like growing up.

    Erik Martinson: Thank you very much appreciate for being here.

    Erik Martinson: No I mean what’s good I mean that was born out so socom as you mentioned and yeah, went went through and a normal public school and then sort of grew up and and was very technically oriented and ended up at lean shaping university which is 2 hours site side of Stockholm where I started industrial engineering.

    Erik Martinson: And sort of yeah went went through a lot of things on the technical side and also did one gap here in San Diego or actually ah exchange here in San Diego where I also looked into a lot into the electrical vehicles field and the the solar field and then. Ah, went back home. Um, and brought me 2 sandage set the basis for for for the future career here.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, and what was the um, you know how do you land in engineering like what was that process like.

    Erik Martinson: I think I’ve been the first of all my my grand was an engineer and in that sense I mean I’ve always been very technically interested and I think that from my side I mean it’s an interest that I have everything from from um on the tech side as well as on on actual.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um.

    Erik Martinson: Building things and understanding how things work and I think that’s been an interest all my life and that’s probably been been. Ah, yeah, a strong influence why I chose engineering in first part.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, and also when you were in sanio I mean you had the opportunity of really looking around and and and get to see you know different things that also opened your mind as to you know, maybe like like testing you know, small projects and seeing where that would that where that would lead and. That eventually led you to really starting. You know the company that you’re that you’ve embarked yourself in now and we’ll talk about it. Justine a little bit with svea solar. So so walkke us through what were those sequences of events that needed to happen.

    Erik Martinson: So basically I mean when I started in Lyn shipping I’m at brn which is now the co-founder of fiercelore that that started fair with me together and I mean we had some different events I mean we were. We had a student event company and that rented the equipment to different student. Events and and so on in lynchapping and then when we were in San Die we had different sort of small ventures that we tried out I also remember going to ala after I started in San Diego visiting a friend there and I looked into this tesla model less that that I thought was not the best that. Ev in the world. It was the best car in the world and and I actually tried to get a job a test like a couple of times that obviously couldn’t work out very well. But then I mean when we been back in bjon from from San Diego tu li shipping and started to wrap up school there. We started looking to what can we to do together and and what kind of you know renewables can we do and. You know coming to Sweden we thought you know wind is obviously much more effective than solar we thought and we started looking to that one windmill was roughly five Million Euros and and I looked at arn. Do you have 5000000 euro he looked at b no I don’t and I don’t either and we had like $1000 in student funding per per month. So it was quite quite a far gap. And then we started to look into actually what can we do with solar because we saw that happening in San Diego basically and did a math and said like everyone else thought in Sweden that that might work well in in Spain and in San Diego but not so much in in Sweden but we did a math and and we lived into it and said it’s actually a very good financial case and.

    Erik Martinson: Started looking to that then what what kind of players are in the business and um, we thought we could do it quite well and and that was really the basis for for for s sphere solar and we looked at the potential for solar is huge even in Sweden and and ah if it’s working well in Sweden then it’s going to be fantastic elsewhere. And that’s really what we’re seeing now solar will eventually become the number one source of energy. It looks like for for most performances.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, and out of that potential me what were or is that key metric or that key factor that made you think I got I got to go through this I got I got to make this happen. We need to build this company.

    Erik Martinson: I mean basically I mean you know everyone else we need to stop using fossil fuels and and if you start looking into what are the major driving forces for that. You would very quickly understand that solar is the number 1 factor and and I thought that was very inspiring. And and if we can be part of of making that happen quicker then we have done a fantastic job. So that’s really the basis of susl la and and why we’re working very hard to to scale the company as fast as possible.

    Alejandro Cremades: So when you said okay, let’s let’s you’d say screw this. Let’s do this, you know, kind of kind of mentality then what were they? what were the next steps I mean what? what? what were the next steps like and and what were the early days like of the government.

    Erik Martinson: So so basically I mean we really late 2013 December Twenty Thirteen we put together our master thesis mean and bn and the day after we have already planned to to visit the potential suppliers in Germany which was the basis for the solar part in in Europe back then. And and so we you know had one day gap and then we went down to Germany visiting all the suppliers we went there to to the major solar manufacturers in in the world basically and said hey we’re we’re 2 students. We’re going to. You know be the winner in Europe and and it’s going to be good for you to to work with us most people thought that was kind of funny. Ah, but. Some suppliers really looked hey we have no really companies working with us in Sweden so these 2 guys sounds like they’re at least trying to do something so let’s let’s bet on them and they did and they are now our main suppliers today. So I think you know it’s been kind of a mutual good investment I think ah, but but I mean so that that was the sort of. Basis some on what we were doing and in the beginning I mean we had basically no funding at all so we started to do everything so me and bjorn we went and out on the field and did 8 hours of mounting in the day and then did a bookkeeping sales and and and planning and all that 8 hours in the evening so that was pretty much the the. The mentality of what we did for the first year so we pretty much had no employees the first year at all.

    Alejandro Cremades: And then you know you eventually get to a thousand employees right? and and you have you know the sub cities that are coming from from the government you know which are very helpful too. But. You get into an acquisition then all of a sudden you’re like a news start coming from China and this eventually leads to one of the worst times in your professional career. So what happened there walk us through through those moments and and how are you guys saying to turn them around.

    Erik Martinson: So basically I mean we had a very good run and it was a tough first year and and then we started to get things really rolling I mean we we grew really fast. We were profitable. We. We had a good cash flow and we used all the profits to sort of you know gain momentum for the business and then we did our first financial round in February Twenty Twenty to to making an international expansion. But basically so we just started Spain we acquired a company which were present in Germany in The Netherlands and in Belgium and then we started to hear about rumors from some kind of virus in in China which were going to you know, affect us on the supply chain side. Ah, and then you know the acquisition went through first of April that’s pretty much when we got lockdowns in in Spain in in Belgium in in the Netherlands and also parts of Germany. So. So basically ah you know we we were you know. Running full force hiring a lot of people in Sweden in everywhere everywhere and we couldn’t even go to the country so we were having basically a standstill for the entire operations and then also in July, they pulled the subsidies from 20% for residential customers in Sweden to zero over one week ah so we were basically standing there full force growing tremendously. Well and then we had to do actual layoffs which were super tough so we were now a company which was from being the market editor in Sweden now in 5 countries trying to win Europe and then have and got our whole market where where we were super strong.

    Erik Martinson: Ah, we got the subsid cut at the same time so that was really really tough. So so we had to really you know, go back to basis and trying to find out how we can work with with what we have and and really look you know long-term we had. We had strong investors that were backing us up which was fantastic but it was really tough I was at q two q 3 2020 was super super tough and then we started to really gain momentum back and we actually did manage to grow the company during 2020 but not at the scale we were expecting but during 2021 we actually grow more than expected. So we kind of got that game back but but it was really tough and and it’s It’s hard when you have a very strict plan that you’re following and every year you’ve been hitting those targets and then you know you go out to 5 markets and and and corona hit and you have a very very tough hand and and have to do layouts which is really I mean if you look at the culture of sphere. Yeah.

    Alejandro Cremades: All.

    Alejandro Cremades: So Eric oh you see you know, like really tough times you know during this say july 2020 where you need to make all these different decisions. You need to go through the layoffs and and stuff like that I mean this obviously helps you to mature to as a leader. So I think that how how was that for you. And who did you needed to be as a leader to really get in front of what you had you know right? there you know in front of your eyes to make sure that you know you were able to give you know a future and and and and a possibility for the company to not only to to survive but then also to thrive after that.

    Erik Martinson: I mean basically I mean you you need to sort of think about I mean obviously it’s super tough to to make a lot of layoffs for for a lot of people that you think are really good and are trying really good for the company but it’s really about you know you know it was about survival for the company in essence. Ah, so I mean in order to save all the other employees that that was what we needed to do and you know it was super super tough and I mean you start to think about it I mean we have had the opportunity to never really how to do any layoffs. Obviously we had some people leaving the company and we had some people that that was not really working out well. But in essence we had never in this company’s history ever. Had to fire someone or or or lay off someone that we didn’t you know not think was performing as well as I should so it was really you know, tough to to look into people’s eyes that or good good people that were performing really well but basically saying hey this is what the reality is I mean we we can’t have you on the payroll. Basically. That was very tough so that that gives you as a founder and and as a Ceo perspective on how things are and and and but I mean in essence I mean what we’re trying to do and is to build the best company possible for the employees and for for what we’re doing and and and that was what needed to be done.

    Alejandro Cremades: And how do you? How do you deal with that to make sure that you’re able to minimize as much as possible. The impact on culture.

    Erik Martinson: Unfortunately.

    Erik Martinson: I Mean we tried to be as transparent as possible I mean saying this is you know we did this bets. You know we were you know going out to these countries. We were hiring these really good people and ah things were happening I mean some some that we could have controlled some that we couldn’t control. Um. But I mean we tried to be very very transparent and and you know we still have our long long-term vision and we still have a long-term Target Ah Tohi and so I think a lot the people Also you know within the company were supporting us very well within these times I would say ah but it of course is very very tough it. It. It was probably.

    Erik Martinson: From a professional standpoint One of the toughest times I’ve ever had.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, I hear you I hear you now for the business. How much capital have you guys raised late.

    Erik Martinson: So we just raised another I mean basically one hundred Million Euros in in the early spring and then a couple of weeks later we raised another hundred millions to our utility site. We’re also building solar parks. So and then before that we we had raised. Ah you know, roughly twenty thirty million euros so in total I think yeah two hundred and thirty million Euro roughly

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, and in terms of the structure is that you were alleging earlier I mean how how do those subsidies typically work for for a company like this.

    Erik Martinson: I mean so basically I mean there’s different schemes in every country I mean now we are growing tremendously well in Germany which is you know they have some sides especially on the battery side and and in Sweden we still have you know they actually I mean I talked about they took away this subti from 20 to 0 and then they actually went back. You know to four years later to from 0 to to 15 so. There’s some some subsidies but in in general trend. We’re seeing subs being faced out of the market. Ah, but but I mean solar is more and more competitive, especially now I mean the energy sort of prices in Europe is extremely high now. So even without subs solar makes a lot of sense.

    Alejandro Cremades: Oh.

    Erik Martinson: So I think you know in Spain for example, the the subsiess are very limited and and we’re still selling a lot of systems. So in general, it’s really about navigating the sort of subs structures that are in every country but ah long-term I mean solar is will be the cheap source of energy and we’re seeing that happening and that’s why solar is growing. As fast as it is in many market subsidies are there to sort of make the growth more stable and and and increase the rate of the growth basically more than than anything.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, and now for for a company like this. Obviously you know is is capital intensive I mean you’re alluding to it I mean you you you guys have raised you know quite a bit of money. But how that’s the process or how do the financing cycles pan out. Um. Over time you know because I’m sure that there’s a lot of people that are probably listening that are more the traditional Saas you know type of companies and people listening you are maybe more used to those but this is probably a different approach. So How did the financing Psychos unfold.

    Erik Martinson: I mean so basically we have two sides obvious for the company. So I mean we have our our sort of hardware that we are running through to our customers installing the solar parts and the batteries and ev charging and combining that. But also we I mean we’re selling electricity as a company I mean we have energy trading. We also have. Sort of optimization frequency control where we are so using our batteries and eharging to stabilize the grid so we have both sides basically and what we’re doing is basically to get as many assets out there as possible to be able to then get the recurring revenue from every customer that we have so I would say from a financial standpoint I mean it’s really about optimizable work. But when you have all of these assets that you’re bringing out the customer. But also when you’re scaling it at the rate we’re doing I mean we are you know, roughly one thousand employees and we’ll be doing next year roughly four hundred Million Euro in revenue I mean there’s a lot ah of of you know warehouse or parts in the warehouse that we need to account for and.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um.

    Erik Martinson: And you know you can’t get all the credit lines expanding as fast as your company so you need to sometimes also prepay a lot of equipment. So That’s why we need a lot of capital and also to be able to get larger credit lines. You know the the larger balance sheets. We have the easier it is for us to get more credits from our suppliers and so on so it’s really going hand-in-hand here. So So there’s different sort of aspects of raising capital for those types of businesses. But what makes us quite unique in this field is that you’re seeing sort of the clean Tech Trends a lot of the companies are coming from both hardware and software which is historically kind of unique. You have a lot of hardware companies and then you have level lot of software companies where. Most you know battery companies solar companies. Ah ah doing the sort of shift towards renewables are are merging software and and hardware so you’re seeing some kind of like financing for them for for both recurring revenues and heavy assets and and that’s not been. As common in my opinion at least um, previously you have a lot of like hard asset companies and and and a lot of software and now we’re seeing in in the green tech space you need or not need to but most companies have some kind of combination of both.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, and now for a company like this for the people that are listening to really get it. You know what is what is the business model. Really I mean how how do you guys make money.

    Erik Martinson: So basically I mean as mentioned there I mean we make money on the on upfront payment from the customer on on the many of our systems but we also offer rentals meaning I mean you can literally say that you’re leasing the system or or have like a 20 year rental on the system. Ah, where you get recurring revenue. But also then adding on the entity contracts meaning that you know you know we don’t only supply the solar for them. But you can also sell back your solar and then when you don’t have enough solar in your system. You can then buy backendage from the Gri which is also creating sort of ah an entit energy as a service product.

    Erik Martinson: And then with that being said when we now see in Europe. The prices are you know 10 x on the day compared to the to the night time it makes a lot of sense to work with the batteries and store the energy and and ensure that the customer is using the energy at at the Cheapest point and also.

    Alejandro Cremades: And.

    Erik Martinson: Taking off loads of the grid because the the price are high because the the grid is constrained or or they’re very limited production in the grid at that time. So we’re stabilizing the grid and I would say over time that platform will be our largest asset when we have millions of customers out there that are using our systems and we are ensuring that they’re sharding the car at the correct time.

    Erik Martinson: They’re offloading the batteries at the right time and producing solar and so on and combining that also with heat pumps in the future as well and and Ac systems that will really ensure that we can create a system where we can really balance the grid because if you look at the 3 megatrans out there I mean we will electrify all transport over time.

    Erik Martinson: Will electrify all industries over time and we will at the same time ah need to ensure that the grid is fully renewable and all of those 3 trends are putting tremendous constraints on the grid. So everything we can do as a company to take off the constraints of the grid. We will have a massive add-on to society and hence we can then you know.

    Alejandro Cremades: Oh.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, and right now how how big is the company I mean anything that you can share in terms of may like be.

    Erik Martinson: Ah, get value out of that as a company.

    Erik Martinson: Um, I mean we’re one thousand and forty

    Alejandro Cremades: Number of employees or anything else that you feel comfortable sharing.

    Erik Martinson: So we’re one thousand employees this this year and we will do roughly turnover this year of two hundred and thirty million Euros so and next year about 400000000 as I mentioned so we’re growing quite steep and and I think we will be I mean our target is to 2026 to one point five billion ah euro in revenue.

    Alejandro Cremades: Evening.

    Erik Martinson: And have 5000 employees roughly so we are scaling up quite fast and and you know it comes back to what a company stands for I mean our job is to take away as much fossil fuels as possible and we can only do that by scaling really fast. There’s basically no other way. So that’s why you know growing is in our Dna. So our job is to scale the company as fast as possible and take away our 3 main competitors consisting of coal oil and gas.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um I love it now. Obviously you were throwing a lot of Zeros in there, you know and you know I could give Vertigo and to to um I mean at least to me you know, like that. Growth I think that you know also when when a company is growing so fast as a leader is important that you’re able to um, grow on the same level in parallel so that you’re not outpayed by by your company. Um, so I guess for you to evolve to grow as a leader I mean. How have you gone about that so that you know you keep you know up with the same you know velocity and speed that the company is is running it.

    Erik Martinson: I mean I mean that’s a great question. Obviously I think that many companies are constrained I mean in the beginning they’re they’re fueled by their founders but then in the later stage they’re constrained by by their founders. So ah, my job obviously as a Ceo is to try to evolve ah faster or at least at the same pace. As the company. Otherwise we will not get the full potential out of the people that we have and really to be able to do that I mean there. There’s obviously a self-improvement ah variable in here. But there’s also ah a very important thing is to realize what are your weaknesses. What are your strength and build ah a great management team I mean we have worked a lot with that and really. You know building. Great people that are working close with me but also all the way down in the company. So I would say if you look at the sort of bottlenecks of scaling the company from one thousand to five thousand employees it’s really to attract the best talents making them grow and creating good leaders within the company also and keeping them with the company so we have also. Made. Ah, ah what I think is kind of an on ah unorthodox way is that I mean our hr officer Hannah Manberg is working in parallel with me so we’re sharing the management team in that sense so that we have the hr agenda at the very top not in the management team at the top of the management team because that’s how you know. We’re focusing on really valuing the the hr side and and creating you know a good path for our employees to grow and thrive within the company.

    Alejandro Cremades: And how would you say that you know obviously when executing and building a company is you can have the best team in the World. You can have a good market. But more importantly, that is being at the right time in history and having the wind. Blowing you know on your back. How do you think that that has helped you guys you know, especially with all this climate change talk you know like in really having the the traction that you guys have today.

    Erik Martinson: I Think yeah I mean obviously ah, the environment that you’re you know, working within your company is tremendously important I mean it’s very very hard to to do very well in a business that or or an area which is not doing very well I mean you can you can define but but having this type of growth. Need to have a fantastic product. That’s so much better than your competition. But if you are in this field like in renewables or or you know everyone knows we will need to take away Fossil Fuels I mean we are not constrained by the Market. We’re constrained by itself if we can grow faster we will grow Faster. There’s basically no limit on the market I mean obviously there is a limit but it’s.

    Alejandro Cremades: Again.

    Erik Martinson: Far off from where we are from today. So I think that’s ah tremendously important. But it’s also I think it’s more inspiring to be able to think about it if if you are doing better. You will actually bring your your product and the the rest of of your sort of your friends in the industry.

    Alejandro Cremades: A.

    Erik Martinson: That are doing better will also bring that product forward faster that’s much more inspiring than working within an old industry that might be growing with 2 3 4 % per year. So if you’re doing well you’re basically taking business from someone else. I mean this is not the case I mean we. Are not looking at our I mean I mentioned you know our competition is coal oil and gas. It’s not out there solar players. Ah so if the constraints is within the company purely. Ah then you should act like that and realize that you should just try to focus on getting the full potential out to your company. Nothing else. And that I think in essence is inspiring.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, now you know 1 question that I like to ask you here is imagine if you were to go to sleep tonight Eric and you wake up in a world where the vision of his. Yeah so is fully realized what does that world look like.

    Erik Martinson: I mean first of all, there will be and no fossil fuels within the energy sector at all that that that is the main goal for sure and I mean I really hope that will happen and and we will work really hard every day to to make that go faster and and I mean. Everyone knows that you know solar and wind has great potential to to take out coal oil and gas gas and other forms of energy as well. But I think in in essence it’s just a matter of of implementing what we already have and doing it as fast as possible. So I mean I would be very happy to wake up. one day and and realizing that it will be a replacement market that we will just replace all customers and not need to get any new ones. The the company will still obviously be there because we will have to maintain all the systems and and and get you know replacements on systems that are not working anymore and because they have a lifestyle span roughly thirty years so there will always be a replacement market. Ah. And that that will be a good future. Ah, but but to to be honest I think that I’m more of a Ceo and a founder that likes to really push the company and and and hit the boundaries and I’m probably not the best Ceo for that type of company that will just stabilize and and and you know try to keep what’s already out there.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, you you, you’ve alluded to it. You know before on on the need for for doing some good and for what’s happening with Fossil fuels and I find that one of the one of the issues that that we’ve.

    Erik Martinson: So I guess I probably would would not be the Ceo of that company I’m quite certain.

    Alejandro Cremades: We’ve been dealing with is the lack of consciousness around this right around the impact you know that those have in the environment. So I guess the question here that comes to mind is do you think that that consciousness now is maybe opening up. Do you think it’s people are more aware of of what’s going on.

    Erik Martinson: What I think there’s there’s always like different types of of hot topics. But if you look at them a Megat trend which is renewables I mean and environmental and and co 2 emissions that that a lot of people are talking about. Obviously there’s been debate on how how much is ah human-m made and how much is from elsewhere and so on. But. But it’s clear I mean in essence I mean we will run out of fossil fuels either. We pump them out of the ground or or we you know we just realized that we will you know use solar and wind instead. Um, and in my mind you know let’s let’s try to not gamble and just make it happen as fast as possible and and. I think the debate now is switching from like is is it man-madeed or not and it’s like I think most people are realizing that we are causing quite a harm on the planet and and the faster we can fix that the better it is and when we’re also now seeing which is you know, not been the case for for maybe ten years ago

    Alejandro Cremades: Um.

    Erik Martinson: It’s financially logical to also invest in renewables that also shifts the entire sort of mindset of of you know, basically and most investors and and every customer basically so what we are trying to provide is a product that are not only environmentally friendly. It’s a.

    Alejandro Cremades: Are.

    Erik Martinson: Financially superior your product and to what you have today and if you can get those aligned at the debate whether if it’s climate change or not will will sort of fade out and and people we just realize this is a good product and it’s environmental. Friendly. Let’s go with that solution. That’s really been our sort of essence on on not trying to talk too much about this is what the customer needs to do and sacrifice. We’re trying to make a product where you as a customer have a better customer experience and a better product that also will be good for environment I think that’s a way better sort of angle than than so than trying to go and say hey you need to sacrifice that and that and that that you really want to do. And we’re trying to change that to say hey you want to do something with an environment. We can also benefit your your financials at the same time and and trying to package that product for you.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, got it now. Imagine I was able to give you the opportunity of going into a time machine and going back in time and you had the opportunity of going back to that moment. You know when you got started with a company right? back in 2013 I mean we’re talking about almost ten years of lessons learned 10 years of successes you know ups and downs everything you know I mean it has been a tremendous you know journey you know and and and a wealth of knowledge that you’ve being able to acquire them these time. So imagine you’re able to go back. And have a sit down with that younger Eric you know, maybe that younger Eric that you know as being in San Diego taking a look around you know all that stuff and seeing what could be you know a world where you know some a new creation is is brought to life if you were able to tell that younger son or give that younger Eric. Ah, piece of advice before launching a business. What would that be and why given what you know now.

    Erik Martinson: I think first of all I would I would say super important do found a great founder and which I did I mean brn is fantastic and we have been working very well together. So that was I was more lucked and then than than it was sort of thought through. But I mean that was fantastic. So I would say that’s you know.

    Alejandro Cremades: Are.

    Erik Martinson: Do that that that’s some things I would say keep doing that and work with that. But I will also say sort of I mean in Essence being maybe a little bit more calm I mean in the sense that I mean when you see trouble usually as a founder at the beginning of a company you get like almost in panic mode and say hey this is the sort of world going down of the company I mean.

    Alejandro Cremades: We.

    Erik Martinson: More like okay so how is this really going to impact the company long-term or not I mean try to think about you know, really doing long-term decisions all the time and and and not being too paranoid of of short-term failures I mean because that that’s been at least my experience in the beginning of the company when you’re a new founder. You start to tend to. Take a lot of issues very very seriously and I mean you really like ah which sometimes make you lose the focus of the long term. So I think if you can sometimes really realize that there will be a lot of failures. There would be a lot of pain. There would be a lot of things that are going to go against you but also have that Stamina and saying hey look you know. It raised the bar a little bit and or at least raised the the the vision a little bit and say hey it’s going to be okay, this is not really the end of the world because I see a lot of founders including myself in the beginning that were so focused on short-term losses that that you started to do irrational things.

    Alejandro Cremades: Are.

    Alejandro Cremades: Um, understood now for the people that are listening Eric what is the best way for them to reach out and say hi.

    Erik Martinson: I mean they can just send me an email at eric.martinsonatvslo.com. So that’s Eric with a k martinson with one s and and I think you know I will try to answer as as many emails that I get and and. I think you know one thing that I really enjoy is to to talk with other founders and other and entrepreneurs and potential entrepreneurs that that have ideas and that you can discuss with with it either if it’s renewables or other of stuff I mean it’s always inspiring hearing you know people that are on the journey or or you know, starting their journey or have been on the journey for for quite a while that are. You know and talking on how they can improve their business and and what they can bring to the world I think that’s fantastic.

    Alejandro Cremades: Amazing. Well Eric thank you so much for being on the deal maker show today. It has been an honor to have you with us.

    Erik Martinson: Thank you very much appreciate being here.

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