Neil Patel

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Chase Garbarino has built, sold, and invested in startups since he was in fifth grade. Now he’s taking on the world’s largest asset class. His latest venture, HqO, has attracted funding from top-tier investors like Insight Partners, Accomplice, or JLL Spark.

In this episode, you will learn:

  • Office culture, alignment, and building the right team
  • Startup fundraising
  • The future of commercial real estate
  • Incubating business ideas

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    About Chase Garbarino:

    Chase Garbarino is a Co-Founder of HqO and serves as its Chief Executive Officer. He also serves as a Board Member at Technology Underwriting the Greater Good.

    Chase also served as Managing Director at Peak6 Sports. He is also a Founder of Streetwise Media and serves as its Chief Executive Officer. A serial entrepreneur and angel investor, Chase has forged a path for entrepreneurs and drives innovation in various communities across the US.

    Chase has more than a decade of experience forming, launching, and running businesses, such as CampusWord, Pinyadda, and Streetwise Media, which was acquired by American City Business Journals in 2012, all in pursuit of his vision to connect communities of entrepreneurs and ventures with technology. Chase received his BA in economics from Hamilton College. He is an Angel Investor.

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    Connect with Chase Garbarino:

    Read the Full Transcription of the Interview:

    Alejandro Cremades: Alrighty hello everyone and welcome to the deal maker show. So today we have ah we have an amazing founder I think that we’re really going to be enjoying the conversation with him. He’s built a scaled finance exited companies and he’s been starting companies since he went in. Fight in fifth grade which is like absolutely unbeliev I mean some of those companies or I would say initiatives you know were very um, very funny actually and we’re gonna be covering them. But but again you know, very inspiring story and I’m sure that you’re all gonna very much enjoy it so without fardo. Let’s welcome. Our guest today. Chase Garbarino welcome up to the show. So so give us a little a walk through memory lane born in Connecticut how was life growing up.

    Chase Garbarino: All Hondro big fan. Thanks for having me on.

    Chase Garbarino: Life was life was Good. You know I was ah I was very fortunate to have been born into a entrepreneurial family. My ah, my father’s father came over from Italy and had started all sorts of different. Ah, little enterprises. He started a fruit importing Business. He ran a package store. He ran those old vending machines where you could get cigarettes out of I think he did better in the vice businesses than the fruit business. Ah, but the the entrepreneurial gene ah was in my. My family My father ah had started in venture capital in the eighty s very very early before it was really kind of a you know a bigger thing and then moved on to the operating Side. He liked running things a lot better so he did. Ah, he did a furniture company and then he got into Healthcare services businesses where he had ah a good entrepreneurial career and I was lucky to he would bring me along to a bunch of things and I could kind of watch his ah his battles growing up and learn from him which was great.

    Alejandro Cremades: And what was like to see those battles you know the ups and downs and and more than anything you know that that roller coaster of emotions that you go through us on a entrepreneur.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah I mean look I got I got ah ah the best education you could get because I got I got to watch my father. You know he he ipoed a company in the 80 s that was a furniture company that had 1 manufacturer um, that. Went bankrupt in the savings and loan. So you know he went from all the way up here to down here and nothing other than kind of supply chain issues and he had to start from scratch and build something new. So I think I was fortunate. You know a lot of times we only cover the. Cover the successes and we learn about the success and I think seeing how hard it was you know set me up in ways that that have been pretty helpful in in my career and ah learning learning from his journey was huge.

    Alejandro Cremades: So at what point do you really get into the whole entrepreneurial thing knowing that you’re going to you know, go at it. You know eventually because I mean you started with your own projects in fifth grade. So what the hell were you doing in fifth grade what kind of mentality did you have there going on.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, you know I’ve always I always hated school. That’s for sure class was brutal for me. Um, you know I in fifth grade I kind of became fascinated just with like selling stuff making money I don’t know it was it was something that came the. That was always interesting to me kind of innately and so for anybody who was a child of the eighty s there was this playground game called pogs where you know kids would stack these cardboard things and you would hit them with a slammer and you’d flip them and ah. You know pogs were all the rage but I wasn’t interested really in playing them I had my mother bring me to the store so I would buy them in bulk and sell them the kids on the playground so that was my technically my first entrepreneurial venture when I was in in fifth grade. Ah when.

    Alejandro Cremades: And then he just it just went from there. You just kept going. You know, even even doctors notes and what what? what? what was that.

    Chase Garbarino: But we moved. Yeah, yeah, so anybody who was in high school back when I was in high school. You know like the 90 s early 2000 you know there was there was a policy we had moved to Massachusetts and if you were late school. Ah, you couldn’t couldn’t play ah on sports teams or do any extracurricular activities I played a bunch of sports. So um I was one of 3 kids who has taken computer science at the time and I had figured out. Ah how to get into some file servers that had doctor’s notes of local doctors and. Started selling doctors notes that how kids chose to use those was up to them. Um, luckily I have a I have a very ah ah disciplined and strict mother who kind of smacked me around and said like. There’s a lot of good energy here. But let’s focus it on things that you know won’t get you wildly in trouble. Um, so that that was in a high school enterprise that I had that I made some pretty good money on. Ah but luckily came to an end before before it resulted in anything too. Bad.

    Alejandro Cremades: Well well well in your in your case, you know though when when you really kick it on the high gear is in college so you go there to study economics to Hamilton and there is where you get really going on ah on your first business. So your first business you know while you were in Hamilton you know that was.

    Chase Garbarino: Ah.

    Alejandro Cremades: Compost word which was a user generated you know type of um, ah, platform or website and you guys were monetizing in the good old days. You know with the ads with without words and and so forth. But. But also I say you know a pretty interesting approach and and I’m sure that they you were turning some heads there. So How was that experience Now you had your cofounder you know your your team around you you know doing this thing. So How was that like what what was that journey like.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, so I was still doing you know I was always interested in technology and I had been reading magazines this is around 2004 2005 people will remember back then. Collegehuor.com was was a pretty big success and I was kind of looking at this like user-generated content model and so and a good friend of mine at Hamilton Kevin Mccarthy who sadly I traditionally took computer science. He was just a chem major but he’s a lot smarter than I am so I convinced him to learn how to code. And you know we we started ah a platform called campus word where we reached out. You know we built a platform reached out to about 500 schools and said we’re the New York Times of college publications and we waited and we ended up getting you know hundreds of students. You know, producing content for the platform. There was an ad network at the time called adbrightte where you could just make pretty good fees on link ads on the website you know based on views and clicks. So we’re making some pretty good money. Um I had some other angles on the on the venture whereas importing. Ping pong balls from China and selling them to different schools and things like that. So um, you know again is like kind of a dog chasing cars. We would come up with an idea and we’d pursue it but it grew to a point where you know some of the content on the platform was getting picked up.

    Chase Garbarino: And we’re getting calls by Cnn and Fox News and different. You know the media climate was a little bit more tame back then but you know there’s some content that they would call us up and say you know hey you have this position come talk to us. We don’t even know the students writing this content. We’re like 1920 years old ah so it was ah it got it got a lot of notoriety and it was cool to see all the students that wrote for it are now all you know working and you know pretty high up in media. So it Wass a really interesting platform for for a while there.

    Alejandro Cremades: So how did that they transition into American Ino because american youo ended up like the like more like the serious you know first venture you know where you got where you guys did the full cycle. How did how did that transition happen.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, so when we were doing campus word. We didn’t have a business plan. We didn’t have like we didn’t even know what an exit was we weren’t like thinking of it that way it was more let’s do something fun and cool and if we’re making money on it. Great so we ended up actually giving the we. We ran the platform and gave it to students to run themselves. We should have sold it to a college marketing agency. But I didn’t even know that college marketing agencies existed. So again, it was more like we did it because we found it enjoyable and then you know we started to get a little bit wiser than we were and. You know with American Inno we really kind of saw at the time Huffington post was having a lot of success creating this new media model that was user generated content and you know native advertising was kind of the the theme that they had created and we had gotten to know some of the some of the folks on the technology side that. Ran Huffington post and they were coaching us on like hey there’s an opportunity to do something similar but really go after local media. You know they were very much kind of national. Um, so we we built technology to try to cater to kind of like the local media audience we thought we could do a better job than you know, local. Newspapers and a lot of the traditional media businesses. Um, so it was kind of 1 part ad tech 1 part publishing platform and ran that kind of found our niche and really b two b business of content and focus and we ended up selling it ah in 2012.

    Chase Garbarino: Couple years after we graduated to advanced publications which is owned by the newhouse family. They own con asked on a bunch of newspapers they had recently you know owned a discovery channel until it got sold to warners so big kind of family own media conglomerate.

    Alejandro Cremades: How much how much money had you guys raised prior to the acquisition.

    Chase Garbarino: We had only raised about $2,000,000 so you know we graduated from Hamilton in 2007 and one of the best things you know and I think a consistent theme right? I got to I got to watch my father go through the savings and loan. Kevin myself and then we brought on our third co-founder Greg Gomer who I grew up with and had gone to babson college ah we went and tried to raise money in Eight Nine Twenty ten right after the great financial crisis so we kind of we cut our teeth at a time that was brutal to. Raise capital particularly in Boston where we’re located and it was very much known for enterprise technology. Not anything you know internet or you know that we famously lost Facebook and airbnb from the Boston area they went went out west because they couldn’t raise funding in Boston so um. We had to. We had to get beaten up pretty badly to to get those $2000000 but turned out to be a good thing because we didn’t over capitalize the business which for our category ended up being important and then you know it was ah ah it benefited us in terms of you know how to. How to kind of run the capital markets process of company building. You know in hard times which I think is super valuable to learn.

    Alejandro Cremades: So the other lesson learning is that the companies are not sold. They are But what do you mean with that.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, you know I I think a lot of folks and you know I’m an angel investor now and I talk to entrepreneurs all the time and they kind of have this idea of you know hey this company is in this space and they’re bigger and we’re going to sell our company to them and that’s just really not how it works. Um. You know, ah it ties back to some of my pursuits earlier where you know we tend to have the most success when we’re pursuing something that we’re interested in and we’ve found something that we think the world needs rather than building something to sell and so you know part of our exit. American Inno was that you know an advisor to our business connected us to some of the executives at advanced publications specifically at the American City Business Journals operating unit within the company and we developed a relationship. With the people there. We never ran a formal process. You know there was a lot of complementary things about what we’re doing. We shared a lot of the vision like they had certain infrastructure and scale that we didn’t we had certain you know technology chops that they needed to transition from. Kind of traditional but it was pretty organic, right? And and I’ve watched a lot of folks kind of show up on the doorstep trying to sell their company which is not what we were doing um and you know we ended up having a great exit at a good time where we got out of you know a category that you know.

    Chase Garbarino: Became harder and harder in terms of display and native advertising. It’s be not a tough space to be in post 2012 so um and I I think that sometimes you’d rather be lucky than good and I think we got pretty lucky that that’s how the process ended up running for us there but we learned an important lesson that you know.

    Chase Garbarino: You don’t you don’t typically like plan to sell things. Some people can pull it off but it’s just very hard to execute a strategy like that.

    Alejandro Cremades: Now for you after the transaction got closed. You received the phone call from the other guy that was under Corp dev team and he was a pro and he kind of like invited you to the office and walked you, you know through. Which areas you know could have been a little bit more improved on your end I mean you you were just 26 so you know obviously you know a lot in front of you to learn and it was obviously the first transaction too. But but how was that like.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, so Andrew Siegel I have to give a shout out to Andrew because Andrew beat me up pretty good in the deal negotiations. You know Andrew’s pedigree was he you know he was very high up in Corp Dev ah ge he’s very high up at korp dev at Yahoo and then he ran corp dev for advance for a while. So this was an experience guy who had was probably working on a litany of deals at 1 time and and when we closed the deal. Ah. They had just moved into the you know one world trade on Lower Manhattan they were the first tenant in the building so it was kind of this crazy experience where I had never been to that property and you know I’m I’m up on a floor I not I don’t think I’d ever been that high up in a nice tower like that you know we had been grinding it out in some you know. Lesser office spaces and he just walked me in and I wasn’t totally sure what we were going to talk about and he was just like here are the things I did in the negotiations where I you know I kicked your ass. Basically he didn’t say it that way but and he taught me a bunch of lessons and it was you know at the time I was kind of sitting there like. Oh my god like I didn’t know like all these you know ah tactics and things like that. But you know it was the best thing that one of the best things that happened to me in my career in terms of just you know it’s paying dividends in terms of the learning experience. So I really appreciated kind of how he had you know he.

    Chase Garbarino: He helped us out afterwards just by investing in in us kind of as a founding team as individuals.

    Alejandro Cremades: So then after the transaction was done and you guys you know did the transition and and all that stuff then you know it’s time to to think about what was next and obviously you know you starting things since fifth grade. You know you were not going to stop so what happened next? okay.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, so we ended up staying on for almost four years with advance and we had a really good run. You know the the company expanded within the advanced empire still to this day. You know Kevin and I are call it. Our. Another called roommate of ours still runs the runs the company for them which is cool. But naturally you know we got the ah once it got kind of pretty well integrated into the into the mothership and we got the itch to start something new so we’ve been ah we had gotten funded by. Jeff Fagnon and Ryan Moore who run accomplice which is a Vc out of Boston They had formerly been known as atlas venture and we just went back to them. We had a good first run with american inno and said hey we’re gonna start something new and they said what? Ah, we don’t really know but we’re gonna do something so. You know they incubated us out of their office and we had these like loose ideas around kind of a software platform for business community. Um, which you know we built a bunch of things that nobody needed on v 1 v 2 and just were kind of chasing an idea with them and they were. Ah, luckily we were. We found some guys that were patient and let us kind of find our way to you know? Ultimately, what became hql and you know what we’re what we’re working on now.

    Alejandro Cremades: So incubating I mean that’s interesting that you guys get together and it’s like hey we don’t know what we’re gonna do. But let’s see what what happened. So so how is that process of you know, just like having like a completely empty canvas and just like throwing stuff at it until something you know clicks and you’re like okay I think that.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah I mean I you know there’s There’s a couple of different. You know there’s no one Playbook I think when people try to come up with this one playbook on how you start a company that doesn’t work because the only playbook that works is what’s authentic I Think to the founding team and you know we’re.

    Alejandro Cremades: This is it.

    Chase Garbarino: We’re a curious bunch of people. Um that you know we’re just we love building things and we kind of naturally find it. You know have found our way to I think areas of our interest problems. We want to solve and the accomplice folks you know. Really have the same dna but on the other side of the table from a you know capital perspective where ah, they’re not They’re not later stage. You know they’ll they’ll play there but where they’re bread and butter and where they’re really interesting. Work happens is kind of on formation and working with founders for the full life cycle. So you know it was it was one of the most fun times my career because we were sitting in their office. They had some other startups that were trying to kick around find ideas. So it was just high density of talent. Sitting there in Cambridge Massachusetts and late nights and a lot of whiteboarding sessions on you know what? the world needed and what the world did ah and that’s kind of how how we got our start with Hbo.

    Alejandro Cremades: So then let’s talk about that moment where this is it. Let’s go.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, so you know we had done. We took a crack at like a b two b marketplace we had done this like kind of b two b concierge thing and like nothing was sticking but we had built all these kind of interesting features and it was. Back half of 2017 when wework had gotten their you know astronomical valuation from Softbank and a lot of the folks that we had been dealing with in version. 1 of what became hq o. We’re in commercial real estate and from our time and advanced publications. They had a big commercial real estate advertising business so we had always been fascinated with commercial real estate because you know ah real estate is the largest asset class in the world much bigger than you know publicly traded equities. So. Just from an asset class perspective. It’s a massive category and then when we started kind of looking at what we work was doing and we’re like this is fascinating because everybody says they’re a tech company but they’re not a tech company. They’re a real estate services business that’s masquerading and trading as a tech tech company and commercial real estate. Fundamentally is just a laggard when it comes to digital adoption and so you know when we looked at other hard asset businesses so transportation what uber and lyfted and hospitality. What airbnb did they didn’t come in and lease arbitrage the hard asset which is what work wework was doing.

    Chase Garbarino: And I think there’s a very viable business. Actually you know despite all the challenges that we work has gone through but we kind of saw this opportunity where it’s like look you have an app for your car. You have an app for your bank the way you interact with things happens through through software predominantly mobile. We spend all this time at. Buildings right? And and there’s no way to interact with all the different workflows of a property and that’s kind of how we we kind of had the light bulb moment went to accompass guys and said this is the this is the thing and they said look if you can sell it to landlords who are a brutal category to sell into. We’ll fund it and so they said sell 1 we’ll fund it in q one of 2018 we sold 4 landlords and off to the races. We went.

    Alejandro Cremades: Wow. So then what’s the ultimately the business model. How do you guys make money.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, So ah, 81% of our revenue comes from Landlord clients you know now we’re we’re larger so we sell into a couple different customer segments. But really anybody who’s in ah in the business of operating real estate right. So um, we sell them a platform so that they can facilitate a great customer experience at their buildings and you know they they pay a base platform fee and then they pay for the amount of users that end up ah coming to their properties and using the platform.

    Alejandro Cremades: And so far for the for the company. How much capital have you guys raised that are you say publicly disclosed and how has it been the journey I mean obviously it sounds like the.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, it’s about 150,000,000 today you know that.

    Alejandro Cremades: You know you guys had it a little bit easier this time around I mean not only because you guys were successfully exited founders but then also because you were in you know, incubated by this you know Vc ah firm and they were able to see you you know from from day from day 0 pretty much so how has it been you know going from the you know early days to you know. All the way up until now raising money.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah I mean there was ah 1718 when we started working with accomplice. It was. It was definitely different than 22009 2010 twenty eleven so you know when you make when you make folks some money that helps immensely that obviously helped we obviously also were in a much better market for venture capital and fundraising than we were after the great financial crisis. Um, and the you know the track record in relationship right? like ah. You know another vc who good lesson that I learned from said you know we invest in lines not dots. They see you at 1 point in time. It’s a dot but when they see you in multiple points in time they can start to see the line on whether you’re somebody who sticks with it and makes progress and so we have kind of a line relationship with you know, our. Set of investors from the first company but you know we kind of hit the market at a time where wework was really adversarial with a lot of the real estate community. So our our kind of first momentum was by saying you know you need your own customer platform to. Collect data on how people are using your properties and it was a bull market. Everybody was making a ton of money in real estate. So you know all right? Let’s try something innovative. We got kind of our first initial customers that way.

    Chase Garbarino: And we were very lucky that we closed our series b financing December of 2019 that was led by insight partners you know top 5 kind of global technology investor because when we walked into our first board meeting with them in April of 2020 we were all locked down and the world changed so they just made an investment in. A company that’s selling real estate to offices and governments around the world wouldn’t let people go to offices so it went from some smooth sailing to very quickly back to rough waters so that was ah it’s felt fitting for our journey because it’s you know. Just seems to be the environment that we operate. Ah.

    Alejandro Cremades: And and how how has it been like for example, like going through those murky waters too with investors. You know, like how do you?? How do you go about that. How do you?? How do you deal with you know board meetings you know in in such a tough you know environment like you guys were in you know like I mean Covid you know was. Pretty uncertain, especially given the business that you guys are operating So I’m sure you know it took a lot to to keep pushing things through.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, um, this is where I got lucky. Just again, kind of seeing how my father operated growing up where you know not a lot of people have someone who’s gone through a couple decades of board meetings. So I got I got to take some of his lessons and you. You know he hit me up very quickly and was like brutal transparency right upfront like all the dirty laundry don’t hide anything so you know I’ve got ah a pretty good cadence where every single board person gets a call gets a run through before we even do the board meeting. So nobody’s walking into surprises like we. We put an immense amount of time and investment into the board relationships which I think some entrepreneurs um sometimes underutilize you know, ah how how to work with board and how to manage a board. So I think we’ve we’ve gained a lot of credibility because we’ve you know we’ve been able to. And essentially ten x r revenue from December Twenty nineteen to now and I think a lot of our investors when covid hit thought we were dead and so we managed to both share very openly some of the challenges because there are a ton of challenges when people can’t go to buildings for our software category. Ah, but then we’ve also found ways to to grow and really create a category of software that didn’t exist before um so you know that that was critical and we also tapped into the real estate market.

    Chase Garbarino: It’s inherently an investor business and so we brought a lot of Capital partners in from the real estate World. So We brought industry Expertise We diversified our capital sources at a time when you know more more folks that you can draw on for capital the better. Um, and it took a lot of calories. But. Ah, it’s it’s paid off for where we are now.

    Alejandro Cremades: And also you guys are big on office culture. You know, tell us about this.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, we were one of the first companies to bring people back and you know part of part of it is you know, look. It’s our it’s our product obviously and you got to you kind of got to believe in what you do, but um, I’m also somebody who just believes in showing up and I think there’s something. Kind of special about working with people in person I think the um how you empathize how you learn from people just you know the dating back throughout human history innovation has always clustered so whether it was the renaissance in Europe or it was the industrial revolution in Birmingham and then. And the Connecticut area here auto revolution Detroit internet revolution silicon valley media finance fashion in New York Life Sciences in Cambridge like there’s some energy about talented people bouncing off of each other that tends to drive. You know, innovation and economic progress. And so the you know the business we’re in is you know we’re trying to build something really new and innovative and you just cannot replace in-person interaction and so you know I’ve got a lot of friends that love ah, remote work and sitting at home and you know it’s not really ah a moral thing. Like good for them I’m I’m in judgment of no one. But I fundamentally believe that you know I want to work with people who want to be around their teammates and I believe in what comes out of it and it’s not just for the good of the company I think it helps people progress in their careers in a lot of interesting ways. But I think for you know for a lot of leaders right now.

    Chase Garbarino: There’s this ah particularly as capital becomes scarce culture dead is a real thing and so you always have these people that good people talented people. But if they don’t believe and they’re more mercenary than Missionary. You know that. That will always catch up to you in hard times and so I think that you know one of the most important lessons that I’ve learned throughout my career and I used to screw this up is that kind of the the mission fit and the culture fit. It’s it’s It’s an absolute must have when the market gets tough. You know you can. In bull markets and 0 interest rate environments when Capital is free. You know you can skip it. But you really can’t skip it if you’re trying to build something that endures you have to have people that are aligned with culture and the mission. Um, and again I don’t think I think people conflate it too much to you know judgment of there’s no one right way to work. That’s the nice thing about having a diverse economy like different strokes for different folks. But I think when you’re building building a company as an entrepreneur you know there, you cannot overemphasize culture fit.

    Alejandro Cremades: So that let’s let’s talk about this a real quick here because obviously we’re talking about people. We’re talking about the investors we’re talking about employees then obviously you know what’s what’s happening now with the with the environment if let’s talk about the vision. Let’s say you were to go to sleep tonight. And you wake up in a world where the vision of the company is fully realized what does that world look like.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, so whether it’s twenty thirty twenty forty twenty fifty whatever the times scale but you know we we’ve been talking about smart cities for a really long time and it’s just a buzz word and like a glimmer right? But when you think about more and more. Of our cities are being connected to the internet. Our buildings different components of our buildings like are starting to be connected to the internet and you know a software platform that really helps facilitate your experience of interacting with the built environment just doesn’t exist. And so really kind of having a remote control for how you interact with your city or any city that you go to? That’s ultimately the manifestation for the consumer of what ah you know a smart city platform would deliver and you know, really a frictionless seamless experience across cities and I do think that cities are humanity’s greatest product. Um. That’s ultimately the platform that we’re building.

    Alejandro Cremades: So now let’s say I put you you know into a time machine. So let’s talk about the past but with a sense of reflection and I bring you back in time you know perhaps to that time where you were still in college in Hamilton and you’re able to have a sit down with that younger self.

    Chase Garbarino: Are.

    Alejandro Cremades: And you are able to give that younger self one piece of a device for launching a business. What would that be and why given what you know now.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah I think the the one piece of advice I would give to myself is um, focus right? Like I think I think too often when things get Hard. You’re closer to success than you think and. You know when if a rocket is off by one degree. It can land in the ocean if you’re just one degree to the left. You can have a successful takeoff and I think you know endurance in Stamina and kind of gritting it out when everything feels like it’s Broken. You can’t get that funding. You can’t get that customer like. Would say you you tend to be closer than you think and this game usually comes down to who can endure most you know you need. Ah you need a certain Baseline intelligence but I think most people who are who are in this game are are smart enough. It’s it’s can you can you weather the storm and so you know focus focus focus. Small adjustments incrementalism always important, but um, you’re usually not as not as far off as you think.

    Alejandro Cremades: That’s amazing now for the people that are listening Chase that will love to reach out and say hi. What is the best way for them to do so.

    Chase Garbarino: Yeah, you can find me on Twitter cgarb I’m very active on Linkedin and I’m always open to talking to entrepreneurs so cg at h go dot co is my email and I love to you know, love kicking around ideas and at least teaching people what I learned what not to do.

    Alejandro Cremades: Amazing. Will he see enough so Chase. Thank you? So so much for being on the deal maker show today. It has been an honor to have you with us.

    Chase Garbarino: Ah, which I have plenty of those lessons.

    Chase Garbarino: Ah, thank you so much for having me all hondra.

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