Neil Patel

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Ankur Rungta has started not one, but two companies. His venture into cannabis alone has raised over $100M. The venture C3 Industries has acquired funding from top-tier investors like Navy Capital, Madison Square Park Capital, and WelCan Capital.

In this episode, you will learn:

  • Surviving COVID as a company
  • Operating in a highly regulated industry
  • How to ride through the challenges of a startup without getting burned out

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    About Ankur Rungta:

    Ankur Rungta is co-founder and CEO of C3 Industries. Ankur brings years of experience as a corporate attorney and investment banker to the company, with a specific focus on corporate finance, real estate, media, and cannabis.

    Together with his co-founders, Vishal Rungta and Joel Ruggiero, Ankur’s entrepreneurial spirit and passion for producing high-end, quality cannabis products have led C3 Industries to be one of the leading cannabis brands in Michigan and Oregon.

    Prior to founding C3 Industries, Ankur worked as an investment banker in New York, at Moelis & Company, and was a corporate attorney at Sullivan & Cromwell. In both roles, Ankur advised clients on a variety of mergers and acquisitions and capital markets transactions across a range of industries.

    Ankur holds a Juris Doctorate degree from the University of Michigan Law School and a Bachelor of Business Administration degree from the University of Michigan’s Stephen M. Ross School of Business.

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    Read the Full Transcription of the Interview:

    Hey, guys. Today’s episode is brought to you by Zencastr. I remember back in the day when I was looking at putting together Zencastr. I was looking for a solution that would help me in putting things together. Essentially, this is what allowed me to bring DealMakers to life. Basically, Zencastr, what it is is an all-in-one solution where you just send a link to the person that you’re looking to interview. They would plug in their computer with their video, with the audio, and then you are good to go. You would piece everything together, give it to your audio engineer or even edit it yourself, and you are off to the races. Now, if you’re looking at getting into podcasting, you should definitely check Zencastr out, and you could also get a 30% discount, and this is the discount code that you will be able to redeem by going to Zen.ai/dealmakers0. Lastly, I was very much blown away when I found out that investing in wine has been one of the best-kept secrets amongst the ultra-wealthy. This is now not the case anymore. I came across this solution, which is called VinoVest, and they are a great solution that allows you to diversify investing by implementing or including wines into your portfolio. Take a look at this: wine has one-third of the volatility of the stock market, and yet it has outperformed the global equities market over the past 30 years with 10.6% annualized revenues. It’s a really good way to diversify your portfolio, and you could also get two months of free investing by just going to Zen.ai/dealmakers, and by going there, you will be able to redeem your discount.
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    Alejandro: Alrighty hello everyone and welcome to the deal maker show. So today. We have a very interesting guest. So this entrepreneur you know it’s say it obviously it it reminds me a little of myself because he also did from legal to investment banking then from investment banking to an entrepreneur entrepreneur. And I think that we’re gonna be learning quite a bit today on his journey and also on on building scaling and financing a company in socha heavily regulated and top space like is cannabis. Ah, but again, you know I think that we’re gonna be learning quite a bit so I guess that without further ado. Let’s welcome. Our guest today. umur rukta welcome to the show. So originally born in Collubus Ohio but you grew up in Buffalo in New York so tell us a little of your upbringings give us that walkthrough memory lane.

    Ankur Rungta: Thanks Aljandro Happy to be here. Appreciate you having me.

    Ankur Rungta: Yeah, absolutely yeah, my my parents are immigrants from India they moved to this country in the 70 s and my dad moved to Columbus actually to go to Ohio State University for his graduate work. So I was born. There. My dad was in the auto industry so he bounced around a little bit. We moved to Western New York Buffalo area when I was 5 and I lived there until I graduated high school so most of my formative years in Western New York yes I am a bills fan. It’s very painful but you know you’re it’s part part of being from from Buffalo and and yeah, and actually my my brother who’s the co-founder of c three. He actually still lives in the but. Low area. So so we’ve got a lot of ties there and then and then after that I ended up going to to Ann Arbor Michigan to to go to the university of Michigan for undergrad

    Alejandro: And you did everything there in Michigan I mean undergrad law school. Why why did you go to law school.

    Ankur Rungta: You know it’s ah it’s a great question I had studied almost exclusively kind of math Finance. You know, very quantitative subjects growing up and in high school that was always the focus. You know my my parents like a lot of Indian parents had aspirations that I might want to be a doctor someday and and I unfortunately. Dash those expectations for them. But but yeah so I studied a lot of quantitative subjects I I focused on finance and accounting as an undergrad and so I started feeling like you know it would be good to to round out my skill set and and focus on something a little different and. Really wanted to develop ah a different set of skills a different set of muscles and and that was the idea.

    Alejandro: But you even became a lawyer. So I mean what? what? what was the thought process behind hey you know I’m going to go into becoming a lawyer because you definitely course correct very quickly. You didn’t last too long as a lawyer you.

    Ankur Rungta: Yeah, well you know it’s interesting I mean I I was a lawyer for a short period of time and I really it was a very sort of corporate. You know law transactional sort of environment. So the way I looked at it coming out of law school is I thought it the the way for me to develop the best set of experience and. You know most rounded skill set was to do a few years of law and then a few years in finance and I felt like that combination could be really powerful and so you know coming out of law school I had an opportunity to go work at Sullivan and Cromwell which is a great firm in New York and and you know I’d always heard phenomenal things about that training that experience. You know it can be very intense but I think you get a lot out of it as well and so so for me I think it was it was not about doing it long term but it was going in putting in the two years you know really trying to get a lot out of it. Get a lot of reps in and and then ultimately I transitioned over to the investment banking side.

    Alejandro: Now on the investment banking side I do interview a lot of entrepreneurs that have that investment banking side. You know type of background or or consulting background and you know they they go on and become really great entrepreneurs and I guess that’s because maybe. As an investment banker. You have the exposure to what works and what doesn’t you know when it comes to to businesses but really looking at it from a thirty Thousand foot view and seeing the outcome. So what do you think you know for you as an investment banker. What what kind of background or or training did you get. In order to understand how to execute or operate better. You know later on.

    Ankur Rungta: Yeah, look I think ah I think both my investment banking and my my corporate law time you know that experience has been really valuable for me in this business. You know, certainly when it comes to things like capital markets balance sheet management. Thinking about how to finance and capitalize these businesses. You know I’ve got a deep background on that side I’ve got a lot of relationships in that world too. So it’s been really helpful I mentioned my brother he he has a similar background background he was in in banking and then in private equity and so so he built some really interesting skills. You know from the from the. Private equity side as well. But you know our our business is very kind of it’s an environment. That’s that’s got a lot of capital markets activity. It can be very deal heavy meaning you’re often entering new markets. You’re you’re entering into. You know, real estate transactions or or different types of operating partnerships. So. It’s a really heavy deal-making environment in this industry and so I think in cannabis in particular as a Ceo of a company you know as ah of a multi-state business that’s growing all those skills come into place. So I think’s I think it I think it’s been really. I feel like there’s actually quite a linear path in what I did in finance and and what I’m doing now

    Alejandro: For and talking about the path 2016 was aby a year and not only you know you want you? you went at it and you started 1 but you started 2 companies. So so walk us through this process and how things unfolded for you to all of a sudden see yourself there like.

    Ankur Rungta: Yeah, yeah, look I think ah honestly I always felt like I would do something entrepreneurial. So for me, it was just a question of when and and what the right opportunity was and and you know I mentioned my brother because him and I were very much in that mindset together and and looking to sort of exit the traditional finance world and and.

    Alejandro:mBuilding 2 companies and.

    Ankur Rungta: Something more entrepreneurial and so so in a sense. It felt very natural for us I think that’s where our inclinations really are and and you know we’ll talk about this more as we get into this discussion but like we really do view ourselves as operators meaning we don’t we’re not driven first by capital markets considerations or or finance. Considerations we really do think about the business in terms of fundamentals and so I think we have a great perspective on the finance piece of it and the capital markets piece of it and and we can be you know I think pretty effective in that part of our business but we’re also you know we’re really trying to operate the business in the right way and the fundamentals and so. So I just mentioned that because it it really was always part of our thinking but but yeah we left we both kind of left a finance role at the same time and and we had been really kind of exploring 2 different 2 different verticals 2 different industries one was of course cannabis. That’s our primary business at c 3 industries but we also you know. We’re also looking at film opportunities and and it started. We started you know doing small film financing deals actually in the in you know, kind of twenty thirteen timeframe and doing that you know so a series of small. Kind of investments in the space really kind of got us familiar with what was going on there and made us think you know what we can actually develop and produce our own content over time and and that’s ultimately what we did so we launched Nichol City pictures around that time which is our our film and television company and then c three industries which is our cannabis business and. And really on the media side. We have 2 partners that run that business day-to-day you know I’m primarily involved kind of strategically at the board level and and then c three is really what I what I spend all my time on.

    Alejandro: So Then let’s talk about C three because you know 2016 was really the time where the incredible wave around Cannabis you know was was really forming and and it’s unbelievable like how the industry has exploded in a very positive way since Then. So. So Why Cannabis I mean how how do you come across Cannabis and and why did you feel that this was you know a business that you had to build.

    Ankur Rungta: Yeah I mean look I think for me, it started at a personal level. Um I’ve always been very passionate about Cannabis. It’s been part of my life. You know my entire adult life and so at a personal level I have a huge passion for for Cannabis for flower you know I’ve always. You know I’ve always sort of been ah a connoisseur of great cannabis flower and so so started I think from ah from a personal interest but I think as you know as we were kind of getting into our professional careers. Our finance careers. You know I was also watching sort of what was happening on the regulatory front and. It just you know there’s clearly this this incredible you know, rare opportunity to to see ah an industry come out of prohibition and and get built. You know, right in front of us from the ground up and so so it was very exciting for me with my personal passion to also have an opportunity to. Sort of be part of the these initial steps into the license you know and regulated world and so so it was great Timing. It was something I felt like I was you know cut out for I had the right skills for between you know myself my 2 Co-founders. You know we we felt like we checked all the boxes meaning we could raise the capital we could. You know manage the balance Sheet. We could build a great Organization. We could actually operate these facilities and produce great products which ultimately you know that was the goal more than anything and so so you know you know you mentioned how quickly it’s grown I mean I tell people often I view it as a gold rush mentality around this industry meaning. Um, it’s inherently, ah drawing just a huge amount of interest and I would say um, almost you know over? you know there’s there’s almost too much interest at times and that’s why it has to be regulated in a certain way. You know just like other comparable products. Um, you know. While I’m generally ah sort of ah a capitalist free market guy I think you need to put certain certain kind of Frameworks in place around these types of industries and so but but it truly is I mean it’s ah it’s incredibly dynamic environment. Incredibly competitive. A lot of smart people in the space. Um. But it’s got a fluidity that can be really challenging and and and it’s not an industry where you can sit still you have to be moving all the time and you have to be thinking about your next next steps and and the market is evolving so quickly and and so differently in each of the states that it Again. It’s just ah in my mind I you know I. I Think unique, maybe too strong of a word but it’s definitely a very unusual environment and and one that you have to be on your toes

    Alejandro: So what ended up being the business model of C three for the people that are listening to to get it. How do you guys make money.

    Ankur Rungta: Um, yeah, so our business is you know we’re what’s called a multi-state operator and Ms. so. So so effectively what that means in cannabis is we have business operations in more than one state and that that is to be differentiated from companies that have only a presence in a single market in the us a single state. And so among the Mso. So you know, kind of spectrum. there are you know there are there are half dozen very large um Msos that are in 20 plus states and you know have $5000000000 plus public market caps. There are another few dozen Msos that are you know anywhere from 2 to 10 states. Some are public some are private like us. So we’re kind of in that midcap mso so territory. But you know with with aspirations to continue scaling our business and and ultimately you know our goal is to be you know in that leading category of of companies in the space. And and how we you know our our business model is is at this time we are vertically integrated in the four states that we operate in so we’re in Michigan Massachusetts Missouri and Oregon in all 4 of those states we hold cultivation processing and retail licenses and you know happy to go into more detail about why we approach things that way it is. It’s a little. You know, unusual compared to most industries to be to be you know involved in all parts of that of of the you know of that chain. Um, but that is our model and and you know on the on the ah, please go ahead and.

    Alejandro: So why do you guys? do that? What? what? Why don’t you expand on that? Yeah, so why don’t you expand on that so that you know because people broad listening now are wondering like why? why you’re tackling it that way on the execution side. So so would you mind expanding on that.

    Ankur Rungta: yeah yeah I think there’s a few reasons for it. I mean some of it’s driven by the regulatory environment and so ah, you know if you’re in a market and you’re already having a presence there and there are lucrative opportunities to go downstream or upstream and capture more margin and. Particularly if you’re in a limited license state where you know there’s sort of ah a regulatory limitation on how much competition there may be and so you know it just often makes sense once you’re already there and if you have those opportunities to grab up. You know more revenue more margin and and try to capture more. Market share in those in those states and I think you know the challenge can be. You know as a business is there. You know cultivation processing retail there are three very different businesses and so I think that it can be dangerous if you’re if you’re you know for some companies that are trying to do that but not able to execute it. Well. Do think it’s important that you look at each each of those 3 functions individually and and make sure that you’re actually you know, kind of running ah a strong business fundamentally. but but I think from our standpoint if you can do that and you’re in some of these markets then it does. There’s a real strong rationale to try to grab that market share. Margin and and build these types of vertically integrated platforms I think as the industry matures um, you’ll probably start to see more differentiation more specialization certainly as the markets open up from a regulatory standpoint some of the logic of being vertical will also kind of go away and so. You know I think we view ourselves first and foremost as a product company and as ah as a consumer products company in the cannabis space and so I think our long-term focus is gonna be primarily on the production side of things but you know as I say that we’ve got 20 retail stores and we’re we’re gonna be adding more so it’s certainly a major part of our business. But. But I do think that over time we really want to establish ourselves. You know as ah as you know a strong kind of cpg company in this space.

    Alejandro: How and how much capital have you guys raised today.

    Ankur Rungta: Um, to date. We’ve raised you know over $100000000 and that’s in different forms about 65 or $70000000 of that has been is is on the balance sheet and that’s through some equity and some debt and then separately we’ve also raised another. Thirty forty million dollars of sale leaseback capital and that’s primarily to finance our large production facilities and that’s a pretty commonly used financing structure in in this space just given the lack of you know, traditional commercial real estate lending um options and so. So in total between balance sheet and sale lease back. You know over a hundred million dollars

    Alejandro: And typically when you go and raise Capital I mean obviously those are very sophisticated investors very specific. How do you go about finding those because those are obviously different than the ones that would so would find us like the traditional tech startup Or. Or brick and mortar or or whatever that is I mean in this case is is pretty innovative. Obviously a space to that where you have not only the risk of building a company but then also the risk of dealing with regulation. So How did you guys go about finding those investors.

    Ankur Rungta: Yeah that’s a great question now look I think just at a high level. It is absolutely a challenging capital environment. Um, ah you know a lot of your traditional financing sources. Certainly you know the banks are not lending into the space. Even your ah you know your large and. Institutional equity players in the us are are for the most part not touching the space so you’re really you’re really limited to either. Ah, you know specialized. Ah you know lenders in in the industry which some of those guys are you know have have public vehicles. Some of them are private or you’re looking at. Specialized private equity or family offices that are looking at the space. So. It’s a pretty narrow spectrum of what’s available to you so that I think that’s the first challenge you know in our case I think we really benefit from the relationships that Michelle and I have built my my brother and I have built over the years you know we we take a lot of pride and we often say this and and we joke about it with our old. You know I worked in Molus and company which is ah a very active investment bank in cannabis now and I always joke with those guys. We’ve never paid a banker a fee and we’re really proud of that. We’ve never paid a broker a placement agent. So we’ve done it all direct through our own relationships and. You know when we’ve raised rounds of capital. We’ve gone out and effectively syndicated them ourselves to groups of investors and and that could be combinations of family offices. We’ve got a number of of cannabis focused private equity funds in our cap table some friends and family from from earlier on. but but really it’s been mostly that family office. And small cannabis- focused private equity fund targets that we’ve gone to and and you know I’m I’m always a big fan of trying to do it ourselves. That’s been a lot of our strategy is try not to pay fees. Try not to um, you know take other forms of dilution or cost in these things and so. Not everybody can do that and I understand that and it’s it’s frankly for us. It is a big um sort of resource question of you know as we go forward and continue to scale our business. Do we should we be doing that ourselves or does it is there actually a logic to bring in the right partner. You know, either investment in banking or placement agent or whatever it may be because I think there’s there’s certainly a time and and energy that goes into doing it ourselves. But but we’ve we’ve had that fortune of doing it ourselves up to this point we’ve been um I think really again, focused long-term so we’re trying to. Not just find any capital but we’re trying to find the right sort of capital that aligns with our vision for the business and that’s part of the reason we didn’t take the company public early on when there were opportunities to we felt like that would create a different sort of short-term pressure on us that that we weren’t that we were trying to avoid.

    Ankur Rungta: And so so we’ve been pretty deliberate about how we’ve done things we’re we’re not you know, very levered up like some companies in our space are we’ve tried to limit our use of leverage as much as we can and you know just try to do things in a step by step deliberate sort of way and and through a lot of direct relationships.

    Alejandro: So now in this sense I mean when when anything that you could share with the audience to kind of like get an idea of the scope and and the size of C three I mean is there anything that you can share around maybe like employee number or anything else.

    Ankur Rungta: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Um, so yeah, our current head count is is between four hundred and four fifty and that’s across you know all 4 states as well as our corporate team. Um, you know we expect to do in 22 give or take one hundred or one hundred ten million dollars of revenue just to give you a sense. Um, and we do expect to generate pretty meaningful ebi on cash flow against that we’re we’re very very focused on trying to keep our operations efficient and show you know, true kind of cash flow and profitability to the market. We think that’s ah you know that’s how we sort of build real value long term. So. So so that that you know hopefully would give people a little bit of a sense of what we’re doing.

    Alejandro: So now you were alluding to the headcount and also I mean in this company, you’re building it with your brother I mean you know it’s interesting because on there’s a book. It’s called the founder’s dilemma. You know, very good book and on that book. They. The author. He’s a professor at Harvard. He talks about how the dynamics you know tend to be a little bit different when you build a business with a family member. So in this case I mean it sounds like for you guys it has worked being family members and working together. Not

    Ankur Rungta: You’ll have to ask him someday. But yeah I’ll give you my perspective on it.

    Alejandro: But hey you you you you you build something successful I mean that that’s ultimately that that’s our result so I guess why do you think? why do you think it has worked between the 2 of you guys. Okay.

    Ankur Rungta: That’s it’s a great question and something that we talk a lot about and and we get asked about a lot I think ah you know to me and it’s it’s I think some family partnerships can work really well and some don’t and I think it it really comes down to the temperament of the individual people and how well they fit together. And I think in our family.. There’s just 2 of us. You know we grew up very close.. Our family is very close. So Certainly there was like a strong foundation there already that you know of of you know, just a very tight relationship and a lot of trust I think Beyond that though I think what’s interesting for bashall and I is that. We are very different in our in our kind of views on things in some cases we often have different perspectives but we feel like they’re very complimentary and I think we’ve learned how to play off of each other’s strengths and you know ultimately take our you know different perspectives and hopefully. You know, distill them together into ah into a balanced view and a balanced perspective on things and and so I do think that there’s been a really nice complementary nature to to the way that you know to the different way that we look at things and the different perspectives that we have and so so I think that’s what’s what’s kind of kept us. You know as a company kind of in a good balanced Position. We don’t You know we don’t go too far in the direction that I want to lead Us. We don’t necessarily go too far in the direction that he wants to lead us and we we seem to find a good a good place and and we’ve got a really kind of open ah ah transparent sort of a relationship. So. There’s. You know which I think is just absolutely Crucial. You know in any partnership but but certainly when family’s involved and so you know we’ve just again having having that level of trust we can really kind of have any discussion without it going to a negative place and and and we’re I think we’re very open to saying you know what you’re right in this case, let’s. Let’s follow your guidance on this one you know or or you know we’re we’re we try not to be ego driven with each other which I think is really important.

    Alejandro: Got it now Obviously Covid has been challenging and then also Covid has been a game changer for for for many many companies too. What what kind of impact or or how has been that the that transformation for C three as a result of the impact of covid

    Ankur Rungta: Yeah, now it’s ah it’s been an an incredibly interesting couple of years you know and and and challenging of course and you know the way that we think about it in terms of our company’s history. You know we founded it in late 60 early 17 but our first operating asset went online in March of 18 so if you think about it we’re in March of 22 right now and March of 20 covid started. So basically we had 2 years of operating in a non-covi environment and then since then we’ve had 2 years of operating in a covid environment so fully half of our sort of. Operating life as a company has been in this in this world that we live in so it’s it’s pretty interesting. You know you forget sometimes how long you know this journey has been now. but but you know it all you know I remember vividly February of 20 you know I’m a pretty voracious you know consumer of of news and and I follow international. News pretty closely and and you know I I told my colleagues my partners in early February I said we got to get ready for this thing right now it’s there’s no way that it’s it’s gonna you know, not kind of spread to other parts of the world and and of course we saw what was happening in China at that time. So you know we started. Ah. Having some very intense discussions in in that month of February cause our candidly our expectation in the beginning was that we would be forced to shut down or reduce our staffing levels or you know do something fairly extreme and you know and in our business particularly on the production side. You know you’re growing plants. It’s in a perpetual cultivation cycle. So there really is no way to turn off the facility even for a matter of a few days without really destroying your business operations and then you know it could be a six month restart of that facility then and so we had no idea whether would they force us to shut down. Could they tell us. Have to go to a skeleton crew you know so we started making all these contingency plans. Um, you know as an organization if your revenue shuts off immediately. There’s still a lot of costs you know and fixed costs in place. So we we started looking at liquidity planning and and all kinds of you know, challenging stuff and and painful discussions. But. You know we we tried to prepare ourselves as best we can as we could and then and then you know the way it ultimately played out which is fascinating is you know, pretty much in every state in the Us that has a licensed cannabis market cannabis was deemed essential and that you know was not something that I think industry leaders had any. Real expectation of if anything most were worried that it would go in the other direction and so being deemed essential allowed us to continue operating and so we we literally never shut down even for a minute any of our production facilities. Our stores our corporate team we made of course adjustments from a safety standpoint. But.

    Ankur Rungta: You know we literally operated every day through I I traveled extensively throughout 2020. There was no. You know we had a lot of assets and development all around the country in the different states and so you know for me personally, there was a tough you know, sort of calculus of of how much risk am I willing to take you know. What do I want to accomplish with my business during this time and it was you know my wife had an opinion of course I’ve got young children so it was ah it was an interesting time to say the least and for us you know we made the call that we were going to push through it and continue executing our plan. We frankly didn’t really feel like we had any other choice. And so I often tell people that in March of 20 we had our we had an oregon production facility operating we had a Michigan production facility operating and we had 1 retail store in Michigan since then we’ve opened another dozen retail stores during covid and 2 new production facilities and so. You know we’ve marched along all the way through and and and made it work. But but even you know even in in continuing onward and and operating that you know created its own challenges as you know, just making sure our our team was safe that we were taking the right precautions again, we operate brick and mortar retail and manufacturing businesses. So. There’s no way to avoid having people there and so it was just a question of how to do it in the safest possible way and and really balance. You know, everybody’s well-being with continuing to to grow and develop the business.

    Alejandro: Now imagine I put you into a time machine and I bring you back in time to 2016 where you were getting started. You know with with visal and and and and the founding team you know with with c three and imagine you had the opportunity ah of having a sit down with your younger self. And give me that younger ankor 1 piece of advice before launching a business. What would that be and why given what you now know what you now know.

    Ankur Rungta: Um, look I think in cannabis you know I’ll answer the question in 2 different ways I think in cannabis what we’ve seen and and I think the biggest lesson that we’ve learned is that as much as we. Believe in ourselves our products our brands you have to pay attention to the regulatory environment because it has such an impact on the business itself and and what I mean by that is I started the business. Our first operating market was Oregon and the thesis was. We know it’s very competitive. We know there’s no limits on licenses but we can compete anywhere. We’re confident in our model and and surely enough we’ve done. Okay there. We’ve made money but the reality is there’s only so much success. You can have in a market like Oregon because of how saturated it is and and so since then we’ve learned you know what. We also need to look at markets that have less saturation that have more limitation limitations on licensing and so while our core thesis that we’re gonna be the best and we’re gonna operate strongly on fundamentals and we can compete in any market that continues to be the case I have a healthier respect for the regulatory piece and what it. The the impact that it has on on businesses and so so I think from an industry standpoint I would say that’s what I would tell my younger self is don’t be so confident that you can overcome any regulatory environment because you’re such a good operator. You know take take that. Take both things into account in ah in a more balanced way and then I think generally as an entrepreneur. Um I think that ah you know I’ve I was always taught you know by people that I respected mentors and told you know this is a marathon It’s not a sprint ah you know. Kind of prepare yourself mentally in that way and and don’t get too high. Don’t get too low. You know, understand that there’s gonna be challenging moments but you know the most successful entrepreneurs are the ones I think that can kind of navigate those and stay pretty balanced and not burn themselves out. Not. You know, get too excited and too you know confident too arrogant and and blow up their business that way and so I think really understanding that it’s a long process and that um you know trying to not you know, really try to maintaining that that balance and that balance view on it and. And and and then I think for your own mental sanity. But also I think that allows you to make the right decisions for the business long term and so so I think when I started this I didn’t fully appreciate that and I would get you know, worked up in a good or bad way over. You know you know.

    Ankur Rungta: In retrospect, what were more minor things and I think I’ve learned now that that it’s just not a healthy or successful way to run a business and and so and I think you know other than the you know so having a billion dollar idea in some tech space or something I mean most most paths to success are long and and you know. Take a lot of hard work and and there’s no, you know there’s no quick. There’s no quick. Ah you know, quick path and in most cases so you got to be ready to put that time in long term and but also approach it the right way mentally.

    Alejandro: Absolutely so anchoror for the people that are listening. What is the best way for them to reach out and say hi.

    Ankur Rungta: Um, I think the best way is email always um, you know my email is is ah you know out there but it’s encore at http://cthreeindustries.com so I’m always happy to talk to people that are aspiring entrepreneurs or you know interested in the space so that that would be the best way and then. You know I’m pretty active on Linkedin. So I would say if people want to follow me on on Linkedin then you know, um I often kind of ah share some of my thoughts on the industry and other things there.

    Alejandro: So amazing. Well anur thank you so much for being on the deal maker show today. Thank.

    Ankur Rungta: I Appreciate all Andro Thanks for having me. It was great conversation.

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